Notts Lad oop North
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Posts posted by Notts Lad oop North
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Ha Ha! Sadly Amazon control sale prices and £2.01 is the minimum you can sell it for. Why the odd penny? Amazon is a USA company so you have to price books first in US dollars and the lowest allowed price is $2.99. From the £2.01 sale Amazon take 30% and the UK government take 20% VAT so I am left with a quid and a penny. The buyer is supposed to pay the VAT but I have absorbed the price. You cannot buy a pint of beer, a pack of cigs nor even a decent coffee for £2.01. I wont be getting rich any time soon but it wont stop me writing.......
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Quite right, it would make amazing TV - but you dont know the half of it. I have spent the last 7 months researching and writing this almost unbelievable story and have just published my 74,000 word book on Amazon. I have not used any modern accounts and went back to the original 1851 accounts in newspapers. I can tell you why Sarah Barber did not hang. Petitions in both Nottingham and Eastwood raised 11,000 signatures in 2 days to have her death sentence commuted to transportation. It was a close run thing - she still came within 28 hours of hanging and the scaffold and barricades were already part-assembled when a messenger arrived by train from the Home Office. I doubt if anyone knows the coroner investigated two reports of poisoning in Eastwood, nor that the Eastwood surgeon who carried out the post mortem failed to discover arsenic and declared Joseph Barber died a natural death. It was only because of Joseph Barber's brother contracting another surgeon that arsenic was discovered.
Sarah Barber's is an almost unbelievably tragic story from start to end and she had but a few short years of happiness in Tasmania.She inherited a fortune from her grandmother equivalent to over £300,000 in today's money. She married too young at 17 and to the wrong man. If you made up a story like this it would be declared fanciful. If anyone is interested you can read the synopsis for this book and look inside and read the first few chapters for free. Just click on the hyperlink or image below and dont worry there is no compulsion to pay the £2.01 cost of the e-book. I dont have print copies but you dont need to have a Kindle to download and read e-books. You can download a free app for iphones or smart phones or ipad or any pc or laptop from Amazon.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Arsenic-Sally-Curious-Eastwood-Poisoner-ebook/dp/B00VKUSIDK/
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Hi everybody, I started this thread in April 2011 when I realized that one of Nottingham's worst murders were commited almost at the bottom of my old street in Bakersfield. I have been researching the amazing background to this well known story that has become part of Nottingham folklore.The end result is a book I have written and recently uploaded to Amazon. Please click on the link below, you can see the cover and also look inside and read the intro, prologue and the first two and a half chapters free.
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00M20HOPU
I would like to thank those who have responded by posting here, Rest assured those pictures of Saville's Crossing came in handy. Would also like to thank Kath James for sending info about the Saville family. Now then....... do you all recall the famous boy up the tree who witnessed the murders. Variously described as either playing truant from school or bird-egging or both? Well I can reveal here this is a total myth! There were no witnesses to the murders! The numbers killed following the execution have also been wrongly and inaccurately recorded. Painstaking research over many months and mostly in Nottingham Central Library has proved that the old stories are casualties of the truth. I discovered what really happened in 1844 and its all in my book.
I have been uploading draft copies of my book chapters to my blog and know people have been following links from this thread. I am about to remove them all as they do contain mistakes and inaccuracies. The book was totally reorganised with new chapters and some new information. I will leave them up for just one more week just in case anyone wishes to read them. The finished book is now ready for downloading at a cost of just £1.80
Thanks again,
Mike Sheridan aka Notts Lad oop North
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Looking for a map of Sneinton in the 1800s and thought there used to be some on here? Am I dreaming or have the maps been removed?I know all about about copyright but the law is clear - 70 years after the death of the copyright owner which surely makes old maps out of copyright?
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Have to say Toton is the best compromise and between Nottingham and Derby with plenty of space with all those disused sidings. Its not for the common man is it and in any case many will never see it completed with that ridiculous timescale - dont think I will.......
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I believe Hymeks regularly worked as far as Leicester Central to take over the two BOMO holiday trains, as Firbeck states they were seen on the Peak line. Recently sold a Hymek slide at Derby, on a passenger heading north. Dont know if that was a service or test train. Rmour has it the odd Western go to Derby too and quickly returned to Brum but as Firbeck says no Warships as far as I know....
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"The LMS used Victoria Station from about 1944 & B.R.(Midland Reigeon) until the L&NWR/GNR joint closed to passenger traffic in 1951? "
Er sorry No! Nottingham Victoria was a joint GNR and GCR station. These two companies were amalgamated into the LNER from 1 jan 1923 when the BIG FOUR were created. These were
SR
WR
LMS
LNER
Nottingham Midland became an LMS station after 1923 having been a Midland Railway station. The LMS did not use Victoria, they used Midland.
The LNWR became part of the LMS - they had rights to use part of the GNR line from Bottesford into Nottingham and had a lage goods yard and shed in Sneinton and trains from Northampton continued to run into Nottingham London Road Low Level up until the 1940s. They also had a steam shed at Colwick which shut when they were absorbed into the LMS..
In 1948 the Big Four became BR or British Railways
BR had four regions
BR (S)
BR (W)
BR (M) Nottingham Midland in this..
BR (E) Nottingham Victoria in this
Railfans have their own versions of what the railway initials stood for eg
Great Central Railway - Gone Completely Railway
LMS - Hell of a Mess
Manchester Sheffield and Lincoln Railway - Muddled Sunk and Lost Railway - this along with its "Southern Extension to London through Nottingham was a precursor to the GCR!!
It took me a long time to work all this out!!
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Been doing a lot of research into Framework Knitting to help me write a historical novel based in Nottingham. Framework Knitting once supported nearly half the population of Nottingham and Lace Making most the other half. These two trades were related, I used to watch my late grandmother making lace with those old bobbins but in truth the lace was mostly made from machines developed from FrameWork Knitting machines. If you havent seen one get down to Ruddington FWK museum, they have loads but sadly were not demonstrating any when I was there so I am still not 100% clear except they were like looms and had to be hand ( and foot) operated plus the operator sat on a beam inside the frame. Nottingham Derby and Leicester were the main UK manufacturing centres, London another. Leicester was noted for woollen hose, Nottingham was cotton and Derby was silk. The machines turned out mostly hose ie socks and stockings but could make other items like gloves and pantaloons. Later they could be used to make most cotton clothes as sections of cotton material were cut up and sewn together to make goods.
The Framework Knitters were the original Luddites smashing frames around Nottingham and especially in Arnold. They were also involved in the sacking of Colwick Hall, burning down Nottingham Castle and a mill at Beeston. They were involved in Chartist riots. I imagine that many many Nottingham folk will be descended from Framework Knitters yet so few people know anything about them.
Yes they did first work at home on a single frame, mostly in a upstairs room and the top window would be enlarged to let in more light. They then started putting one or more frames in a single storey outside workshop, or upstairs in a workshop, often in the garden of a house owned by a merchant. Eventually lage numbers of frames were set up in large warehouses. However the trade came to and end with the invention of steam power and increasing mechanisation which could produce more material more quickly and much more cheaply than a single man sitting inside a frame working up to 14 hours a day..
And whoever said history was boring ??
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Both sides of my family were from Sneinton and raised there in the 1930s - 1940s. They had a Christmas Pork Pie tradition but it wasnt for breakfast. Traditionally a large Pork Farm Pork Pie ( and not any other type of Pork Pie mind) was the centre-piece of a large cold buffet meal for the entire extended family and as there wasnt room for all at the table, some could eat off their laps. By tradition this took place on Boxing Day and as you might imagine the slices of pie were thin but enjoyed by all none the less and always accompanied by pickles, mixed pickles and pickled onions. A few years back I decided to try to renew this family tradition, buying a large "Pork Farms" Pork Pie from Marks and Sparks. Pork Farms my XXXXX !!! Tasted nothing like it and now I know why - they now come from Witshire and the Pork is not prepared in the same way. One huge disappointment and a mistake I wont repeat. You see sometimes the good old days really were....... The GOOD old days!!
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Thanks for the replies and esp thanks to Commo - confirmed what I thought,that it was a skipping rhyme. Now a quick update. My sister has discovered there really was a Sally Slick Slack who sold rags ( ie clothes) on Sneinton Market. She found the info in an article about Sneinton Market which I will link to below. Given the proximity to St Anns it wouldnt seem unreasonable to assume Sally came from there. Both my parents were raised in Sneinton and could well have seen Sally in action selling her "rags". I strongly suspect Sally No Nose is the same character........here is the link, scroll way down this page to read the article about Sneinton Market...
http://nottinghamviews.wordpress.com/2008/10/10/the-sneinton-dragon/http://nottinghamviews.wordpress.com/2008/10/10/the-sneinton-dragon/
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A few more words on Warships which were withdrawn very quickly at the start of the 1970s.
They did work regularly into Crewe in the early 60s coming in over the Marches route ( yes that is via Shrewsbury) have some pics somewhere if I can find them.
Diesels inc Warships dropped the D prefix anytime after Aug 1968 but not before - that date was of course the end of BR steam
There are three types of Warships
Class 41
Class 42 Built by BR
Class 43 Bult by North British
Kelly was a Swindon built BR Class 42
D827 Kelly , into service 4 October 1960 Withdrawn 1 January 1972Cut up 13.10.72 at Swindon
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Hi all, couple of pointers.
The Magpie pub was very near to the top of Meadow Lane, almost next to the level crossing and on the right walking up to the top and before the 3 bridges. I just cannot forget that pub it had an amazing inn "sign", a 3-D rendition of two magpies in a cage looked like it was made of pottery.
The Ginger Tom was a modern pub built near the flats up near the Colwick Woods and actually either on the site or just to one side of the railway bridge going over Colwick Road. bridge was demolished mid 60s.
I too played in Monkey Park, the big attraction was the huge ( and very dangerous) climbing frame. No softee rubber mats to land on, if you fell off the top of that that would be a trip or two to the fracture clinic .... or worse. Mylate father told me he could recall that park being opened, prob late 1930s.
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Does anyone recall rhymes or indeed the real names or stories behind these two. My sister thinks Sally Slick Slack lived in St Anns and here is a rhyme our mother told us as children..
'Sally Slick Sack sells fish, 3 aypence a dish, dont buy it, dont buy it, it stinks when you fry it' !!
Anyone know any more esp about Sally No Nose ( we think thaty was another rhyme)
Love to hear some more about this.....even if they are fictional characters!
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Seems to be a lot of confusion here, prob because there was indeed a pleasure park at the end of Trent Lane but there was also Colwick / Colwick Park which was just down from this pleasure park and boats did pull in there as late as the 1960s. I visited the Trent Lane park as a child in the late 50s, there were a few rides,one like a chair-o-p-lane, some arcade machines and there were some railings near the Trent shore to allow safe bathing. Must mention this pleasure park was nowhere near Trent Marina which is a 1970s-19800s creation and was cut out of old meadows beyond Colwick Hall between the old Trent course and the new one leading to the sluice gates. My uncle who was raised in Sneinton recalls "Peg-Leg" as the one legged ferry boat man of Trent Lane, who did a roaring trade when Forest played at home.,dont think he was the same famous high diver! Quote from my uncle..
" The fastest way over the Trent from Cosby Rd was to go down Trent Lane and have a chap called Peg-Leg row people across! I believe he lost his leg in the war. In his early days he rowed people across for a penny each way, but he must have become quite affluent at those high charges, for I believe he upgraded to an engine
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Surely Ned Ludd was a mythical figure much like Robin Hood - and like Robin would disappear into said Forest when the Kings men ( soldiers) came calling. Been doing some research on Framework knitters and you wont find any old mills in Arnold that carried out the trade. The frames were small enough to fit inside a small cottage and this was very much a cottage industry. Look for weavers cottages ie those which seem to have longer than normal upstairs windows -these were used by the stockingers or framework knitters to create cotton cloth which was then turned into socks and stockings. You should find these all around and within Nottingham. The big windows were there to let in more light. Need to get some pics of these cottages so if anyone knows where there are any would welcome the info......ps the frame or framwork was basically a giant knitting machine - and they could use silk and wool as well as cotton.
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And the Manvers is being taken down brick by brick and palleted up?
Why ? surely its not being rebuilt brick by brick -or is someone going to recycle the the old bricks and use them again? A lot of my family from Sneinton used this boozer!
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reading your post brings back memories of my younger days . we visited every cinema in the meadows during a week . i remember the imperial on wilford road , the grove on kirkwhite street and the globe at trent bridge
Wow what a memmory. I went to one of these when I lived in Meadows to see Guns of Navarone when it first came out in the early 60s -Kirwkwhite street sounds about right. Just cannot recall a cinema near Trent Bridge and I lived very nearby.....
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Many of you on this forum, like me, no longer live in 'The City of Dreams'. Do many of you go back very often, how do you view the place if you do.
I was born in Wollaton in 1950, I had a great childhood, I went on to Bilborough Grammar, surfed the pubs in the late 60's, lurked around the Boat Club, the Uni, the Poly, had a lot of fun, had a missing period when I went to college then came back for 5 years, lived life to the full, thoroughly enjoyed it then ended up Daan Saaf.
Ever since, it's been difficult to get involved, you go and spend the odd weekend with your parents and do what they want you to do, it's not the same.
Unbelievably, my Essex son chose to go to Nottingham University, I've visited, but it's not the same is it. He takes control, I've been on a pub crawl but it's like going to the moon, I've had my moments, but things are so different. My best moment was on my last visit, I made him and his pals go for a hike up Mam Tor in a blizzard, they loved it, but it doesn't reconcile an old git with the fun pubs he once loved, they don't exist anymore, sad, but not unexpected is it.
So what are you 'expats' relationships with the place, is it on another planet, or what, I'd like to know what you think.
My experiences are similar to you Firbeck.Born in 1953 I lived in the "Medders" - the "posh" end mind, with the big 3 floor terrace houses and my dad was the first ever in his family to get a mortgage. Went to Trent Bridge Junior School then in 1963 we moved to Carlton (Douglas Ave) A very happy year at Parkdale Primary then I passed my 11+ and went off to Carlton Le Willows Grammar. Absolutely hated the 7 years I was there. Then from Sept 71 a four year stint in Manchester at Teacher Training College.Dont know whats happened to the last 40 years and now I am about to stop working. I have been back every year to see family, sadly lost touch with friends in the dim and distant past. I still have great affection for Nottingham but doubt I would ever move back.Living in a big city like Manchester has it benefits but now I would really like to move out to leafy Cheshire. I used to take back Pork Farms Pies and Sausages but you can buy em anywhere now in Marks and Sparks and they DONT taste the same. Never did miss Nottingham beer and thats why I became a lager lout. Still love Birds trifles. I am coming down again in a just a few weeks and will go back for one last trip to Goose Fair in the autumn I will always have the greatest affection and respect for Nottingham but there is a famous saying .. Never look back, and certainly never go back..... Except maybe for the odd day or two! I am sure I would still be living in Nottingham if I had trained at the local college - but leaving home was the making of me and I dont regret it one bit.
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Funny you should say that. around 1970, a friend lived on Colwick Road, on the left just before the church opposite the pub (name?) when going towards colwick. Next door was a car accessory shop. Outside his house was a pole formerly used for trolly bus wires.
That pole had a hole melted in it which I always though looked like it was caused by some kind of weapon?
It may even be still there?
One simple word - SHRAPNEL from the Lutwaffe blitz of May 1941.My father and family all lived in Sneinton and were lucky not be hit by a bomb on Cosby Road. The next morning my dad set off with other lads picking up pieces of shrapnel. You should find shrapnel damage all over Sneinton and I do recall Sneinton Boulevard was still showing the scars in 1960. Yes I know it still has scars now!
PS is the Loggerheads pub shut now? Fantastic history to that place, I always wanted to return but if its closed it wont happen. My great grandfather, an Irish navvy working on the railways was drinking in there in the 1880s-1890s.
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Thanks very much for those views - scenes I have never seen before and I never realized there was a crossing point at Douglas Ave, much less it was called Savilles Crossing! Yes the bridge is still there but much truncated - it only goes over the two old Midland Railway tracks now - it also used to go over three track of the Great Northern Railway too, one of which was a siding into Sands Steel Erectors.
Thanks to to Kath for sending an article about William Saville. I am trying to find out if Saville was on his way to visit family in Arnold on that fateful day in 1844 as I believe I have seen a reference to that effect somewhere......
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Just been doing some research and found that the infamous Savilles Spinney ( scene of 4 murders in 1844) was at the end of Colwick Woods and now built on by houses - not a million miles away from my former home on Douglas Avenue! Been trying to find out some more about the Saville family and what they were doing there. Did find a website that mentioned the family was in the workhouse and were out and about on their way to make a visit that day.
Can anyone help with more info - most websites are concerned with the hanging and the further deaths it caused?
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Trent Lane/Meadow Lane Crossing at Long Eaton on the way to Trent Station.
Well blow me so both Sneinton and Long Eaton had a Trent Lane and a Meadow Lane. Then again there must be many more Trent Lanes in the Trent Valley...
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Ayup Firbeck - where is that Trent Lane Crossing pic with the Class 25 and brake tender? It just cannot be Trent Lane Sneinton as there was no over-bridge for pedestrians there and no empty fields to the right - so where was this other Trent Lane Crossing?
PS may family come from Sneinton hence I know it well!
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Well I must have been a member of 138 First Nott'm Sqdn ATC too as I recall it was down Trent Lane. And my old man was also in this Squadron in the 1940s and went on to join the RAF in 1944.
Sad to say my stay there in around 1968 or 69 was very brief. I seem to recall it was a Thursday night and Sunday morning and I joined at the same time as around another 5 newbies. We were told we would soon get our uniforms but it just didnt happen. About one month in there was a trip to RAF Newton and I had been told what fun this was what with rifle shooting and all. Then came the bad news - only those in Uniform could go. So come the next Sunday morning nearly all the squadron had gone off to Newton and only a handful of us were left behind with one very grumpy old stickler. As soon as we walked through the gates we were shouted at for not saluting the flag. We then had some boring lectures on different types of rivets and then had a competition to determine the meaning of the RAF motto Per Ardua Ad Astra. Well I never studied latin and having just watched a film about Douglas Bader wrote down .. REACH FOR THE SKIES. Well this didnt go down very well but no-one volunteered the answered provided by Mr Grumpy - THROUGH EFFORT TO THE STARS. Quite how air cadets s with no knowledge of Latin were supposed to know all this was beyond me
Well having had enough of this kind of ridicule and control for 5 days at school the last thing I wanted was some more on a Sunday morning. It was made worse by knowing my mates were having a good time at Newton and my main aim in joining the ATC was to get nearer to aircraft and airfields and not spend time being harangued and ridiculed. So that was that - I went AWOL and never went down Trent Lane again. I do wish now though that I had gone into the RAF but thats another story.
Eastwood Murder 1851
in Owt' Abaaht Nowt !
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PDF? They can be converted to Word documents all too easily and then any Tom Dick or Harry could cut, paste and use the fruits of seven months hard labour without doing even 1 minute of research. I have already had some scrote take copyrighted information from my first book Saville's Spinney totally without any permission. Said scrote just copied info from other peoples web pages then claimed the finished product as all his own work....... which obviously it wasnt. So no PDFs sorry for the reasons given here. Pensioners can afford a £2.01 e-book. I should know, I am one!