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I note the article in todays Nottingham Post about the new trams.

Built by Alstrom. In Barcelona? Sod the British worker. Lets have them built somewhere else.

Surely even Alstrom have a works in the UK where they could at least have been built by a homegrown worker.

And then what about all this green bulls--t that seems to be all the vogue these days. How much more carbon footprint to transport the things all the way from Barcelona. Or does it not count when they get the pleasure of denying British workers a job.

And don't forget what Spain is doing to Gibraltar. It is as if nothing is happening there.

What do you expect with the present bunch running Nottingham's excuse for a council.

Anyone else think the same as I do?

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Bilbraborn, the answer is Yes! (From me at least.)

I wonder whether Bombardier in Derby were consulted, or whether they are involved with trams as well as railway rolling stock? Their beer's not too bad either.

It's all right though, because Spain needs all the work they can get, unlike our rich Country, forging ahead with economic growth as we are told by that nice Mr Osbourne who had the grace to thank us all for our sacrifices over the last 5 years.

Nottingham Council are obviously doing their bit for the European entente cordial, so don't be so mean spirited !!

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I'd hazard a guess everything has to go out to tender, and the Spanish company won.

When I worked for the Electricity Commission of NSW in Australia at one of their collieries, a contract was put out to tender for the new powered roof supports for our new longwall face as the Gullick chockshields had just about had their day, plus we needed heavier duty supports.

The tender was won by Dowty UK who undercut their Australian subsidiary by many millions, and the tendered price included shipping from the UK and transporting from the docks, one at a time on semi-trailer trucks...Each weighed over 30 tonnes, so was too heavy to get two to a truck.

Each support cost us $A135,000 each.

So probably the Spanish company won the tender???

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Couldn't give a toss about the tram. I've only found two people who want it in Chilwell, and the disruption has been horrendous on University Blvd and Beeston in general. Sod em.

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Undoubtedly won on price. Under the EU utilities directive everything for public utility type use has to be advertised Europe wide in the OJEC - a daily publication about half an inch thick (no, I didn't mean one-and-a-bit centimetres!). But the tendered price might not be the same as what NET eventually pays. Any variations to the order, requested after the contract will be regarded as an opportunity to load up extra disruption costs and possibly extend delivery deadlines, whether these are actually justified or not. To some companies, variations are regarded as an unrestricted licence to print money, and certain companies have a reputation in that direction...

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Crazy situation, just the logistics to get them from Spain, Like Commo said, when they could have come from Bombardier in Derby, only last year they were killing jobs there, due to lack of orders.

Surely keeping that sort of purchase "in country" is just common sense, even if more expensive.

Bit OT, but like here in oz where we sell off massive tracts of land to foriegn countries, for short term gain, so they can grow food here then ship it back to China or wherever.

Only yesterday on the news it said we were considering selling some huge non profitable cattle stations to Indonesia so they can raise their own cattle here and then ship them back.

Absolutely crazy world we live in ! the long term prosperity of any country should far out weigh short term financial gains of these rediculous schemes.

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I don't think Bombardier make trams, though if they do they had the opportunity to tender for them. Like it or not, we are part of Europe and everyone has the opportunity to tender. We can't realistically launch a whole new tram making industry just because we need a handful of trams. When they turned out to be as good as Rover cars were - would you still insist it was a good idea? The car you drive is probably not a British car but no-one complains about that.

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I complain long and hard about that. I know that Bombardier can make trams. They would do if our MPs had enough shares in the company. If we are part of Europe, why don't they take their green policies seriously. You can't have it both ways. Either a free market or a rigid policy on the environment. It seems that green policies only count if they can fleece the s--t out of the British in their utilities bills. Or make a mockery of our beautiful countryside.

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A least in Britain there is chance some Brit may be involved. When I left the railway 10 years ago there were still plenty of British technicians . But what about this blessed carbon footprint all the trendies keep spouting about?

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The present fleet of Nottingham trams were built by Bombardier, with a lot of the work done at Derby.

I also think keeping work in the UK is common sense. Money spent elsewhere in the EU is money that has left the country. Money spent with British manufacturers remains in the country. But of course, we must keep to the rules - however daft they are. Mind you, you won't come across many trams in Germany that were built elsewhere than in Germany, but of course, many of their cities have trams.

It's not so many years ago that municipal bus operators would favour the local manufacturer, because it kept jobs in the community. Lancashire towns were heavily leaned on to buy Leylands, Manchester favoured Crossley for quite a number of years. Birmingham and Coventry were predictably biased towards Daimlers, and London Transport had thousands upon thousands of AECs.

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StephenFord

Bombardier is a Canadian company, with its head office in Montréal, They have some places in England, but like most multinationals, most of the money that goes through its books go to head office, only a small percentage will stay in England.

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I think what SF and others are inferring to are the employment opportunities for the Brits and the flow on effects of manufacturing to local industry.

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Because I am laid up with a gammy leg at the mo , had time this morning to view these 5 videos of the tram routes .

No 1 is here and 2 to 5 can be found in the sidebar menu.

The first one must have been filmed early morning as its so quiet .

Its more than 30 years since I left and amazing how many places I don't recognise now . Also didn't realise that they went through so much "countryside" especially one of the later video trips that ends up at Hucknall .

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David, I am a complete transport fanatic. However, I am also a realist. I would love to own a top of the range Aston Martin, but one thing prevents me from doing so. £££££££££££££ or lack of them. So I don't have one. No big deal. My old Ford Focus gets me around ok.

So. Back to the tram. I love them. I love trams. BUT! Nottingham City Council really can't afford them. They are having to resort to nasty ways to get the money. Bring in the little lady. She must hate motorists. So she is the right person to think up ways of robbing the motorist to pay for the tram. Not everyone can use public transport. Shift workers. People with heavy equipment to carry. People with tight schedules. If I go shopping in Nottingham (very rare), I will park at Hucknall and use the tram. But if I visit my dad or my grandkids, I am not prepared to keep changing buses as I don't have the time. It is a half days outing to do that.

But to add insult to injury, they are not prepared to give British workers the chance to build the blessed trams. Money to spend in British shops. Taxes going to the British government. Everyone here is a loser.

My biggest fear, now that Labour have retaken the County Council, is that they will extend the WPL to the County. I work at some places for more than a week and could not afford the WPL. Public Transport is out of the question for me as I often finish very late at night.

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Point taken BB .

Leaving aside the politics of it , I just posted it as it gives us ex-Notts folk a view of the city we havent seen for years. Could just as well have been a bloke on a bike with a headcam !

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You'd have known it was a bloke on a bike with a headcam, you'd have seen more of the pavement and jumped a few red lights. Oh dear! What have I said.

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I have never been on a Nottingham tram so I took the 9 minute plus video ride from Station Street to the Forest. It seemed a fairly slow ride, somewhat boring I thought. I know not what day of the week it was or the time of day, the impressing was that it was probably early one Sunday judging by the other traffic about and the emptiness of other passing trams. The thoughts running through my mind were, 1. This ride must be heavily subsidised, if nothing else the driver has to be paid for. 2. Because of the lack of parking ticket dispensers along the route the city was loosing a lot of revenue for car parking & both the city & county drivers were loosing lots of parking spaces, all for the sake of having these non-versatile oversized non-divertible non-self sufficient units with dubious H&S credentials floating around our fair city. If you are a regular user of these trams and you find them convenient for you, good luck to you, but spare a thought for those who they are of no use at all who must subsidise your transport by being charged for parking at workplaces that are miles from where the trams go. I have no axe to grind, trams do not affect me in any way

Compare it with another controversial subject, Where I live, just like you, I have to pay rates to live there. If I said I have a piece of land that could be made into a travellers site for about 15 caravans & vehicles that would be well out of the way of causing anyone any problems but before I arrange for site amenities I need to know what is the going rate for council provided traveller sites. (HOW MUCH DO THEY PAY?). What answer would I get.

What do you think? Can you defend them?

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I can't think where this is leading to, but as for travellers sites, I have no idea what the council would offer, but would they consult with anyone over this?

As for whether the tram is of any use to you or not, the Council do not give a jot. All they are interested in is the money they can squeeze out of you. How long will it be before they find a way of charging you to park on your own driveway. That is after the prices of houses with private parking places rocket.

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We have to pay(yearly fee £40) to park on our own street.

And it's a bargain since the parking scheme was introduced last year we can now at park near our house.

We live close to Loughborough railway station & we used to be a free car park

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In Nottingham they would see that as a front pretending it was for the benefit of the people who live there. If there wasn't loads of money in it for them, then they wouldn't give a toss.

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Every single councillor I've ever seen on TV comes across as being insincere, shallow, gregarious, self centred, pontificating, puffed up, forked tongued, slimy, greedy, self promoting, prima donna know all little bas***ds. Every damn one. Number one is all they care about.

They want us to be beholding , subservient door mats, whilst they lord it up with their big cars, big salaries, big smiles and big egos.

Up against the wall the bloody lot!!!!!!

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