Australia's on fire again


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My thoughts go out to all the folks up in NSW doing it tough. Lived in the Blue Mountains for some time, ten years back. Know the areas that have been burnt out. Look at the maps from the Rural Fire Service and looks like half the state is on fire.

You have to experience the Blue Mountains to understand the area. Not massively high mountains, but wild..... There are areas that have never been trodden on by mankind. Every so often we lose tourists, whose skeletons are found years later. Native trees here are generally eucalyptus, so the leaves are laden with oil, and the ground refuse, when dry, burns like billy oh.

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Same problem down here in Victoria, bazza (#2). The burn-offs are either restricted or the smokies are too frightened to do preventative burn-offs due to a few getting out of control and leaving the

Forest fires are a natural feature in Oz and have always happened, either caused by man or by dry lightning strikes..I recall country fire departments dreaded lightning storms during summer, so climat

These people are cranks?????? You have got to be joking surely?? A hint of what the upcoming report contains: “I am a skeptic…Global warming has become a new religion.” - Nobel Prize Winner for

Koff Koff. I'll be glad when all these fires are out and the smoke clears.

Perhaps these fires might not have been so bad if the stupid Greens political party had not had their way in restricting preventive burn offs.

These people are first degree lunatics and should be made to pay from their own pockets for all the homes lost to these fires.

Baz :ninja:

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Same problem down here in Victoria, bazza (#2).

The burn-offs are either restricted or the smokies are too frightened to do preventative burn-offs due to a few getting out of control and leaving the State with massive compensation claims.

Labour over rode the State Government and kicked out the Alpine cattle men because they did not listen to their claims that the summer cattle grazing kept the fire risk down.

The Dandenong Ranges is well overdue to go up in flames and is just a time bomb waiting to happen....and if it does, the smokies are not going in due to the danger of being trapped by fallen trees that the idiots in power will not let be cut down.

You cannot cut trees down on your own land unless it is a danger and then, you must plant 10 more. Roadside vegetation is waist deep, trees overhang roads but we cannot remove anything because it is the home to a speckled red tit or similar.

Peoples lives are being put at risk because of bloody wildlife!

At least the Abos did one thing right early in the piece....they burnt the countryside on a regular basis in the name of blackfella fire control. Later, our pioneers burnt small areas here and there on a regular basis to prevent fires in summer.

Two hundred years down the track and our bureaucrats sit on their fat backsides, watch homes, livelihoods and people burn and then say.....we will form a committee to look at ways to prevent this from happening again.

The Committee comes back in six months and advises this and that must be done....bureaucrats say that will cost money and everything is forgotten until the next community/house/person is incinerated and guess what the bureaucrats say with much breast beating.....we will form a committee to look at ways to prevent this from happening again.

All the time, the advice of the people on the ground who have lived in the area for all their lives and are experienced in these matters are ignored.

And how do I know this? I was involved with State Emergency and relevant Disaster Planning at many episodes over the years and know about the idiots who regard mere public servants of whatever rank as morons who have no idea how to run things or are incapable of proposing methods to prevent future disasters from happening.

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This is climate change. I lived in Oz for 16 years (25 years ago) and we didn't have this problem then (not on this scale).

Sorry but cannot agree, just before we emigrated 25 years ago there was the devastating Dandenong range bushfires, East of Melbourne, cannot remember the name, black Friday or Monday or similar.

There has been bushfires for eons in oz, as said the Abbo's have been using fire for years and years, its the greenies and bad fire management prevention, thats the problem.

We are currently on the NSW/VIC border near the Murray river, earlier this year a tornado went through and wiped out a swarth of forest bordering the river for around 75 klm's, today I noticed the fall trees are still lying on the ground - why ? the greenies have a policy that all trees that are storm felled must be left where they fall, whether into the river or around it, why ? to protect the wildlife !

For a start its a fire disaster waiting to happen, secondly its a total waste of hardwood timber that could be utilized, but no, the termites are eating it ! rediculous!

I'm talking old growth hardwood forest here not new plantation timber.

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The only thing changing this country for the worse are the bloody greenies and tree huggers - not the climate, Bilbro-lad.

And as for no problems 25 years ago.....read this link - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bushfires_in_Australia

I was on the ground for Ash Wednesday in 1983 both during and after as well as the Dandenong fires in 97.

Even the recent Black Saturday events had people voicing the same as those from Ash Wednesday - summer, hot north winds and dry vegetation equates to bushfires and more should have been done to remove the fuel before the season starts!

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Twenty years ago (1993/4) we came very close to losing our house, and we lived in a major city - Sydney. We could see the flames racing along the Lane Cove River from our verandah in Pymble. And an area where I used to walk the dog most evenings, down along Blackbutt Creek was burnt out. If the wind had changed direction, driving the fire up the creek then our place would have been history.

I do remember a commentator on the radio who had been giving instructions to people on how to protect their homes, getting a phone call mid-commentary, to say his house had gone up. His house had been on the edge of the Lane Cove National Park. Driving our daughter to school at Turrumurra High, a few mornings later I drove through areas of burnt-out bush.

This is what they look like close up:

australia_fires.jpg

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I remember a few large fires from my time down under, 79-89, I've also lived in fear when we lived in the Sierras in California, watching a fire working it's way to us from ridges to the north of us.

Local fire Marshall used to drive around before the fire season handing out "tickets" (fines) if you hadn't cut the chaperal and other weeds down within so many feet of property.

We bred goats and used them to reduce "ladder fuel" Did a good job too.

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This is climate change. I lived in Oz for 16 years (25 years ago) and we didn't have this problem then (not on this scale).

Well,I've lived here since 1968 and it's happened on a regular basis.

Climate change my arse.

Baz :ninja:

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Forest fires are a natural feature in Oz and have always happened, either caused by man or by dry lightning strikes..I recall country fire departments dreaded lightning storms during summer, so climate change my arse...

Same here stateside, but fires here have got more intense since the tree huggers got controlled burns out of fire season banned.

It's ironic that tree huggers use wild life as an excuse and politicians buy the crap, most wild life in small controlled burns escape any danger, but in an out of control intense fire, lots of wild life die and cannot escape the fast moving flames.

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I lived in Sydney for 14 years and never saw smoke in the city. There were bushfires (obviously) and we were pretty close to one just past Sutherland on the way back from to Nowra. Probably about 100 metres from the leading edge, but this was in high summer. My brother still lives in Villawood and he says it's getting much hotter much earlier than it did. Climate change has never been in dispute, just whether it is man made or or not, and all the evidence suggests that it is.

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Earth has been warmer than it is now many times even before man arrived here...It also been cooler than it is now, with man here.

During the Roman occupation of Britain, it must have been a lot warmer, as they grew grapes and made wine in the north east...Try it now!!

Cyclic climate change is caused by that big orange red thing in the sky, and it will keep going on getting hotter and cooler and being a pest, long after we and Nottstalgia are forgotten.

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The scientists disagree. Every warm cool phase in the past has had a reason (earth wobble, volcano, meteorite impact etc), this time, despite all the scientific testing equipment no cause can be found. You either believe in science or you don't. You can't cherry pick. What evidence do you have that the earth is in a normal climatic cycle? None? Then what you believe is an act of faith. Are you religious by any chance?

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There's loads of evidence, according to NASA and other scientific data, other planets are experiencing rises in temperatures, so points to our sun as none of them, as far as anyone knows, are inhabited by living organisms...

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Because it's a load of BS based on money....Al Gore has become a billionaire many times over the issue, he is also one of the worlds worst hypocrites...

He and his family are owners of mining companies who have been fined many times for pollution, he owns a mansion that has a monthly electric bill that would pay yours for many years..He drives in big gas guzzlers, he flies with just a few of his people in private jets spouting we "little" people should cut back on energy use, he owns houses, or rather mansions and large apartments in various parts of the US that have large energy uses, ie heating and A/C

How can you take this man seriously???

NASA have huge complexes that require huge amounts of energy to keep them warm in winter and cool in summer...How can you take them seriously??

NASA's shuttles, before being grounded, had carbon footprints bigger than the average city...How can you take them seriously??

The list goes on and on, it's alright to accuse the "little" people and force higher energy costs on them, but don't point the finger at us, we are exempt from it all.....

It's a hoax to make the rich richer and spread wealth......

BUT, It's you and I and millions of others on fixed income that are paying the price.....

I agree we need to clean the planet up, stop dogs crapping in parks so to speak, I've done my bit over the last 30 years or so, my electric bill is a fraction of what most pay, and when I'm solar, will be even less..

I went fluorescent years ago, they saved me a bundle in electric bills. I do my best to repair things rather than trash them, I don't keep up with the Jones's, never have done, even when I could afford to.

I tried to get the most energy efficient vehicle to suit my needs, I look after my land and don't cut trees down willy nilly because I prefer to see cut grass..

But I won't go along with manmade global warming hoaxes..

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Oh I see. You believe in conspiracy theories too. You only believe in the science you choose to believe in. You disbelieve other science because you choose to because it's trendy. I bet you say you are an atheist too as you believe in science - yet you refuse to believe the leading scientists of our time. You would rather believe the crack-pot extreme fringe scientists that say it's all linked with sunspot activity (though they can't say how that is). Can you tell us HOW you came to your beliefs? Was it a whim? An idle fancy? A trendy thing to do?

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A good book on the subject "Climategate" by Brian Sussman...EYEOPENER!! No conspiracy theories, just fact after fact after fact, backed up with verifiable references..

Over 6000 top world scientists say all the political evidence is voodoo science, there's a list of them that's growing by the day, but you won't find many government paid scientists on that list....LOL

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Here's Brians home page for Climategate, a book I had a hard time putting down, well worth borrowing, stealing or buying!!

http://www.theclimategatebook.com/

Here's a page of reviews for the book...

Reviews
  • “Sussman accurately exposes the bad science, faulty reasoning and subversive agendas of many climate change advocates.”

    -- Dr. Charlie Self, highly acclaimed historian

  • “In an entertaining and authoritative fashion, Sussman exposes the real motivations driving the environmental movement’s global warming agenda.”

    -- Tom Del Bacarro, Chairman, California Republican Party

  • “Brian’s important book comes along just in time to reveal exactly why this Big Lie was foisted on us to begin with – and what we can do to stop it cold.”

    -- Joseph Farah, CEO, World Net Daily

  • “Exposing the fraud, fantasy, and foolishness of oxygen-deprived environmentalists.”

    -- Lee Troxler, Author, former speechwriter to Ronald Reagan

  • “Very readable...entirely accurate, and should make a huge impact.”

    -- Dr. Fred Singer, Atmospheric Physicist, author Unstoppable Global Warming

  • “I am sure Climategate will make a significant difference in bringing this complete fraud to light.”

    -- Lord Christopher Monckton, former science advisor to British Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher

  • “Climategate is the best book to date about this massive fraud...”

    -- Alan Caruba, National Anxiety Center

  • “This is a must-read book.”

    -- Quinn and Rose, Nationally Syndicated Talk Hosts

  • “Climategate is not just about the climate--it\'s about exposing a psychology that is attempting to destroy our nation.”

    -- Winn Parker, Ph.D., Syndicated Radio Talk Host

  • “If you are worried about the direction our country is headed...you will definitely want to read this book.”

    -- Robert Felix, author, publisher IceAgeNow.com

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So the global warming crowd aren't????Get the book, borrow it from your library, won't cost you a penny, I'f I were closer I'd drop my copy off on loan to you...

Believe me Brian makes a cast iron case against man made global warming.

One instance comes to mind, most temperature readings are taken in urban centres, plus airports, all concrete and tarmac, giving erroneous readings. Our own local weather station is set at an airport where summer temps are usually 10-20 degrees higher than in the rural area.

Use those figures and the average will be many times higher than they should be.

The first proof I saw was by a Canadian mathematician, who said somethings wrong here with NASA's figures....He was ignored by NASA, so set his own webpage up...After a lot of bad publicity, NASA did agree, their figures on their website were too high due to the fact they got theirs from weather stations set in the concrete jungles of cities like New York etc..

There's a Finish Oceanographer who has been researching ocean levels around the world, know what??? He says they are dropping!!

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Yes they are all wrong.

You have to do the Sherlock Holmes thing:

""Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth."

They've checked everything else - only man-made climate change remains. If you can't tell us what is making the planet warmer - then you'll have to agree.

You simply believe what you choose to believe, without any proof whatsoever, just a few cranks and crackpots trying to sell books.

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These people are cranks?????? You have got to be joking surely??

A hint of what the upcoming report contains:

“I am a skeptic…Global warming has become a new religion.” - Nobel Prize Winner for Physics, Ivar Giaever.

“Since I am no longer affiliated with any organization nor receiving any funding, I can speak quite frankly….As a scientist I remain skeptical.” - Atmospheric Scientist Dr. Joanne Simpson, the first woman in the world to receive a PhD in meteorology and formerly of NASA who has authored more than 190 studies and has been called “among the most preeminent scientists of the last 100 years.”

Warming fears are the “worst scientific scandal in the history…When people come to know what the truth is, they will feel deceived by science and scientists.” - UN IPCC Japanese Scientist Dr. Kiminori Itoh, an award-winning PhD environmental physical chemist.

“The IPCC has actually become a closed circuit; it doesn’t listen to others. It doesn’t have open minds… I am really amazed that the Nobel Peace Prize has been given on scientifically incorrect conclusions by people who are not geologists,” - Indian geologist Dr. Arun D. Ahluwalia at Punjab University and a board member of the UN-supported International Year of the Planet.

“The models and forecasts of the UN IPCC "are incorrect because they only are based on mathematical models and presented results at scenarios that do not include, for example, solar activity.” - Victor Manuel Velasco Herrera, a researcher at the Institute of Geophysics of the National Autonomous University of Mexico

“It is a blatant lie put forth in the media that makes it seem there is only a fringe of scientists who don’t buy into anthropogenic global warming.” - U.S Government Atmospheric Scientist Stanley B. Goldenberg of the Hurricane Research Division of NOAA.

“Even doubling or tripling the amount of carbon dioxide will virtually have little impact, as water vapour and water condensed on particles as clouds dominate the worldwide scene and always will.” – . Geoffrey G. Duffy, a professor in the Department of Chemical and Materials Engineering of the University of Auckland, NZ.

“After reading [uN IPCC chairman] Pachauri's asinine comment [comparing skeptics to] Flat Earthers, it's hard to remain quiet.” - Climate statistician Dr. William M. Briggs, who specializes in the statistics of forecast evaluation, serves on the American Meteorological Society's Probability and Statistics Committee and is an Associate Editor of Monthly Weather Review.

“For how many years must the planet cool before we begin to understand that the planet is not warming? For how many years must cooling go on?" - Geologist Dr. David Gee the chairman of the science committee of the 2008 International Geological Congress who has authored 130 plus peer reviewed papers, and is currently at Uppsala University in Sweden.

“Gore prompted me to start delving into the science again and I quickly found myself solidly in the skeptic camp…Climate models can at best be useful for explaining climate changes after the fact.” - Meteorologist Hajo Smit of Holland, who reversed his belief in man-made warming to become a skeptic, is a former member of the Dutch UN IPCC committee.

“Many [scientists] are now searching for a way to back out quietly (from promoting warming fears), without having their professional careers ruined.” - Atmospheric physicist James A. Peden, formerly of the Space Research and Coordination Center in Pittsburgh.

“Creating an ideology pegged to carbon dioxide is a dangerous nonsense…The present alarm on climate change is an instrument of social control, a pretext for major businesses and political battle. It became an ideology, which is concerning.” - Environmental Scientist Professor Delgado Domingos of Portugal, the founder of the Numerical Weather Forecast group, has more than 150 published articles.

“CO2 emissions make absolutely no difference one way or another….Every scientist knows this, but it doesn’t pay to say so…Global warming, as a political vehicle, keeps Europeans in the driver’s seat and developing nations walking barefoot.” - Dr. Takeda Kunihiko, vice-chancellor of the Institute of Science and Technology Research at Chubu University in Japan.

“The [global warming] scaremongering has its justification in the fact that it is something that generates funds.” - Award-winning Paleontologist Dr. Eduardo Tonni, of the Committee for Scientific Research in Buenos Aires and head of the Paleontology Department at the University of La Plata. # #

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