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My aunt Gladys died yesterday. She was 93, and my father's oldest sister. I was not close to Aunt Glad (I certainly am to others) but still its part of the family gone.

My family was a large family in Hyson Green and were decent, honourable working people. They had some attributes that I cannot yet divest myself of, in that they were virtually socialists, very into trade unions and to Co-Operative movement. There was certainly one war hero (whose achievements were only discovered after his death, as he was dropped into Normandy on D Day) and my grandfather, shot in the battle of Ypres 1917. Another uncle lies in Port Morseby, after he died at the hands of the Japanese. This is a family which had values.

After speaking with my father about my Aunt Glad, I question some of the values, and what we would have done nowadays. To sum up, her husband was what we would now call a wife beater. He was a small man with one eye( which exempted him from military service) but he was arrogant and vicious. From being a child I often saw my Aunt Glad with bruises or a bandage on her wrist. I was silenced immediately in my innocence if I asked what had happened. It was something "kept in the family" It was usual for the family to meet at my grandmother's place for virtually anything, Christmas mornings, christenings, weddings, even Sundays. Vaguely I recall some family get togethers where something went wrong and the atmosphere changed. It was Aunt Glad's husband being taken outside for a pasting.

I was a cadet at Sandhurst when I attended one of the very many family weddings. For some inexplicable reason my Aunt Glad's husband (I cannot bring myself to call him an uncle, but his name was Percy) slapped my mother across the face. It was almost as if I had to do something at the bidding of the family. I was angry which would have been more than sufficient for me to do some horrible things to Percy, but there was an encouragement from the family that I should take on the mantle of sorting this out. I dragged him outside.

He spat at me full in the face. I am not naturally violent but I had been on enough exercises in the army where you were put into what are euphemistically called "stress positions" and even for a fit man, 10 minutes in such a position was bad enough. Percy spent a good few minutes in a stress position. Not a mark on him. What I have, to this day, is a disgust at what I had done, but it was "expected" of me. I had in some way qualified myself in the family's eyes.

I suspect that to inform the police of Percy would have had no effect, even into the early 1980s, so the family had to sort it out. There was no other control mechanism on Percy's behaviour. It has given me a perspective on modern values.

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What a sad story mercury,unfortunately in days only just gone by,women were forced to suffer the indigaturies of beatings and the like because divorce was such adirty word,say what you like about modern society at least its better than what these unfortunate women had to put up with.

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It can be very difficult to understand the violent attitude of some people. My paternal grandfather was a drinker, and, from what mam told me, got violent with his wife. She told me of the time he went for grandma and dad layed into him. Fast forward the decades and katyjay and I are researching our family history, and discover that granddad joined the Sherwood Foresters in 1914 and served with them in France until 1918 when he was transferred to the Labour Corps. He was discharged on medical grounds not long before the war ended. One can only imagine what he had been through when with the regiment and what effect it had on him. Drink was perhaps his only solace. It was no excuse, we might say, but who are we to point a finger in situations like that.

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Sadly I suspect that too many women have been mistreated by their menfolk for centuries. I have great regard for those who have zero tolerance towards abusers of women. I would try my best to support the efforts of those who work for greater equality.

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The Press is always reporting some lady who'd been battered and in todays world the men also get battered by the err, err, 'ladies'.

Well women are allowed to stand up for themselves today......years ago they couldn't, it was put up and shut up as divorce was hardly heard of, it was a stigma and there was nothing for women on their own, especially with children................I can remember a few women who had it rough back in the 50's when I was growing up.........Once you were married, your hubby was your insurance policy, he could do what he liked to you.............Now the table's have turned and rightly so................

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It can be very difficult to understand the violent attitude of some people. My paternal grandfather was a drinker, and, from what mam told me, got violent with his wife. She told me of the time he went for grandma and dad layed into him. Fast forward the decades and katyjay and I are researching our family history, and discover that granddad joined the Sherwood Foresters in 1914 and served with them in France until 1918 when he was transferred to the Labour Corps. He was discharged on medical grounds not long before the war ended. One can only imagine what he had been through when with the regiment and what effect it had on him. Drink was perhaps his only solace. It was no excuse, we might say, but who are we to point a finger in situations like that.

I wonder if your Grandad knew my Grandad that might have been. He was a Bantam in the Sherwood Foresters. Died July 1916 as a result of injuries received on the first day of the Somme.

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Abuse and violence are a part of being human unfortunately. I abhore violence in any form, particularly domestic violence but how many of us can put a hand on heart and say there is no situation in which we would become violent. In all honesty, I couldn't and site #1 as an example. Of all understanding, I think self understanding is the most important and leads to the appreciation of reactions in others.

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Tomlinson

I think that my army training meant that I need not become destructive. I needed to sort Percy out, but I didnt give him anything near a "right good kicking" The training made me less violent than would be normally the case. What I did to him was very unpleasant indeed, but left no signs of harm, but rest assured he was in no illusion that he had upset me.

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Malcolm, Who knows if your grandfather new mine. The records of my grandfather's service went up in smoke when the building housing thousands of them was bombed in the next war. I have my grandfather's medals, among which is the Silver War Medal, awarded to those invalided out to wear and so prevent stupid women from giving them a white feather.

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A womans life when we were kids were very hard even if they were in a really good relationship.consequently us as their offspring would generally be a lot fitter as children because we used our legs for which they were designed,anyone genuinely abused or discriminated against should always be supported and protected,but these terms are often misused,ie racial discrimination when the person doing the accusing accuses because they are white or black,and that is their only sin.some groups are particularly aware that because of pc you can accuse who you like however if you are not in the pcsensitive area

then you are open to critisism by the pc correct groups founded or unfounded.

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Blondie (#6), I didn't mean that it's ok for a man to mistreat a woman but not for a woman to mistreat a man. I don't think it's right for anyone to mistreat anyone else. In places like Asia and the Middle East the women are treated disgracefully. If they retaliate you read about them being burnt or stoned to death. It really is horrific.

I've never seen domestic violence but I can imagine the damage it does, especially to the children. In the UK we are lucky that we can get help and assistance in times of trouble for the abused partner and the children. I stated that I can imagine the damage it does but, in reality, I don't think anyone who hasn't experienced domestic abuse/violence can ever know what it's like to live with it.

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  • 8 months later...

ALL my Aunt's and great Aunt's have passed over now,and obviously they lived thru the War and most had Husbands who served,if there was any abuse i never heard of it and certainly never witnessed any.

It was my Aunts who along with Mam/Dad that gave me a great and loving childhood,always full of laughter and tender words when needed,among my Aunt's there was a Katy,Lizzie,Margie,Connie,Eileen,Mary,.........no wonder i like the Forum :biggrin:

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Oh dear ! You're creeping again Benjamin, you'll have Admin after you for harassment !

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her husband was what we would now call a wife beater . . . he was arrogant and vicious . . .

This ^^^

It seems like domestic violence was a normal everyday thing back in the day. My mothers father, who lived in Butlers Hill Hucknall, was a drunk, a bully and a violent man in his early days. He worked at Hucknall No.1 and No.2 Collieries in his time and, as was the norm in those days, used to go on the lash on a Friday when he got paid. My Mother told me many a time he would come home on a Friday howling with no money left as it had all gone on booze and cards. He often set about my Grandmother, Mother, Auntie and Uncle when he was drunk. If they had forewarning they had favourite hiding places to go to one being an upturned tin bath in the back yard. I have to say though he must have been well in to his 50's when I was born and he always seemed a gentle patient man. My Mother did point out though that my Dad, who was a rather large policeman, did tell him, when he came home after the war, that he would fill him in and hide his carcass if he was ever violent again, maybe that worked?
My grandftaher on my Dad's side was a very hard working coal face worker, 55 years or so. He was very religeous and Victorian in his attitude but was on the ball and loved all the moon landings, technology and stuff. He left three rather large houses in Hucknall when he died, two on Allen Street and another on Montague Road.
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Beestonmick

I think attitudes have changed, but the underlying temperaments have not. My father remains a remarkably peaceful man and never became aggressive to my mother, let alone hit her. My uncle was considered to be abnormal, and given the size and composition of my family, (many military) it was decidedly unwise for someone to be so arrogant and nasty. He was small and physically incapable of doing much. This was not the family hard man ruling with his fists. The family did not have any hard men for that matter. It was a large and generally friendly family. In many ways it remains so today. The family had disputes, arguments and insults for sure, but I cannot remember anyone apart from my uncle Percy becoming violent. I cannot remember any family punch ups, drunken rows or anything like it. Just Percy. It was something that we had to deal with as a family. Percy had many pastings, but his attitude never changed. I dont think anything could change him. He was a horrible vicious little man. If he was about today he would be the same.

Nowadays, if Percy had hit my mother at a wedding, it would have been recorded on mobile phones and the police would have taken it seriously. I have little doubt that Percy would have been violent towards women (he never ever picked a fight with any man) today, but it would have been handled differently, and I feel that it is better that the police do take on matters like this.

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I witnessed violence as a kid,in the house and neighborhood.. not good, now as a Dad of three and a husband I keep my MIT's to meself. But as for shouting. You can hear me in Sutton!! But when younger, always had me dukes up!!..still we live and learn eh?

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