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Do you think the young people of today are recieving a better education than we did?I am working on the assumption that the majority of our members are in their 60's or there abouts, and left school with enough qualifications to get employment, I  know it seems a lot more of our young people now go to university after school but I.m talking about basic education what we called the 3 R's and being prepared for life after school

 

Rog

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They ought to have had as every year there appears to be record numbers of higher grade passes. All that I do know is that there are a lot of younger people out there who are extremely poor spellers and can't do simple maths.

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More school leavers go into further education of some sort because there are few jobs to walk into these days.Mass unrestricted immigration does.nt help of course.

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But there are no jobs for these people after university,well not for all of them anyway, on a TV quiz program last week one of the contestants told the compare he had a degree in sommat or other (quite a good one) and the compare asked him " what job are you going onto with your degree?" the reply was "I'm not going to use my degree I want to go into management" then why not do a degree in bloody management ??????

 

Rog

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1 hour ago, plantfit said:

Do you think the young people of today are recieving a better education than we did?

 

 

No I don't! 

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Very positive reply there Jill, would you care to elaborate?

 

Rog

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From what I've seen, literacy, numeracy and basic general knowledge are way below the standards expected of those who left school in the 50s to 70s.

 

I think part of the problem is that teachers are no longer able to teach in the way they once did, often due to disruptive pupils and having to adopt the roles of social worker, counsellor, riot police, etc. 

 

Certainly, where I was educated, it was a case of toe the line or expulsion...not that I was that lucky! Disruption wasn't tolerated and the aim of our education was to fit us for society in the capacity of employment but also to be able to converse with anyone of any age or background on any subject as an equal, without showing ourselves up.

 

 

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Just about sums up the same education that I went through,even though I hated every minute of my school life I wouldn't dare be disruptive in class, not only would it be punishable by the teachers but also by parents,and as you say the threat of expulsion was a black mark on the family not just the expelled pupil, I also agree with you about teachers being unable to carry out their job because of other roles they have,social worker,counsellor and in some cases parent, it is a sorry world we live in and I feel it's not getting any better

 

Rog

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Comprehensive Education is the downfall of the country.

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I believe there is a very determined effort to dumb all of us down.  Television has a major role in that.  More particularly in the schools start early.  I don't blame all of the teachers.  It must be very frustrating for the ones who love their jobs and want to see the kids do well.  As Rog said most of us here are probably in our sixties and older.  We were taught the three Rs. For us lads there were practical subjects like wood and metalwork.  Useful for all our lives.

 

From what I read today it seems to be more important to teach that it's ok to think you are a woman in a man's body, transgenderism.  Does not matter if you think two plus two makes five as long as you don't discriminate.  Don't learn to think and do research for yourself.  Do as you are told by the powers that be. Collect your welfare, watch the Telly and shurrup!   1984 anybody?

 

i recently saw an exam given to young teens in the early 1900s.  I'm ashamed to admit I couldn't answer half the questions.  :unsure:

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We were lucky in the 60s you could leave work on a Friday and start a new job on the following Monday, I don't think their was such emphasis on qualifications when leaving school, if you took your 11plus you could go on to grammar school then university, if all else failed their was the apprenticeship route.

I do think now days school leavers have a lot to contend with, don't get me wrong I am not making excuses for them, the other day we were having a similar discussion about what subjects we covered at school. Cookery, needlework, drama. (I went as you see from subjects to a girls school) when you ask girls now how to cook a Sunday lunch not many of them would know. Having said that they should still be taught the 3 Rs. The problem with our education system is that each time we have a new government they change the goal post so teachers don't know if  they are on there  head or ar!!!!!!. Having said that the teachers have got to teach and make the subject interesting, I can remember my son at the age of 12 the teacher who took chemistry said that if he took his A level now in chemistry he would pass with flying colours, when he left school he did not even have a pass in chemistry, Why! I ask him ? well said my son Mr James made the subject interesting and when we had Mr Johns he was boring.

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When I was teaching, I often had parents ask me to "tell" their children what to do because they took no notice of their parents! Anything from: "Can you tell her to put her coat on?" to "Can you tell him to sleep in his own bed at night and not in ours?"

 

They thought the child would take more notice of me! I always refused.

 

I can just see my parents doing that! I was asked once. If I didn't comply, I was told once. If I still didn't comply, I knew what was coming. It rarely got that far because I was a child and they were my parents. Nuff said!

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One of the problems today is kids have very little or zero respect for any one, they do just as they like because they know for sure there will be no meaningful punishment.

 

I went to an all boys school Ellis 550 plus boys but very little trouble purely because if you were disobedient or caused any kind of trouble you knew just what was coming and you knew for sure it would hurt like hell and you would never tell your parents because they would side with the teacher.

 

It didn't work for everyone but for the vast majority it kept the lid on our behaviour and allowed the teacher to ......teach.

 

In answer to Plantfits question a resounding NO I thing the standards in basic education are well below what was achieved when we left school.

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From what I remember of my school days we were taught about things that were relevant at the time and could possibly be of use to us in the future to help make us good citizens and of course the ability to think for ourselves. have our young people been taught to think for themselves or just accept that what they have been told is the way it is, I hope not because without someone to question the state of things,things will never change,is this the case worldwide or just the UK

 

Rog

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The aim of a good teacher is to teach their pupils how to think, not what to think and to encourage their self-esteem and confidence to the extent that they don't feel compelled to cave in to peer pressure or, to put it another way, become a follower of the herd! I might have hated the Manning but its teachers knew how to achieve everything on the above list!

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I agree with you on the Manning front Jill, as I remember from my time there, encouragement and respect, I gave out a lot of training in the industry I was employed in for over forty years and part of my training was to learn how to teach obviously and one piece of advice given to me many years ago was "in order to be a good teacher you have to be a good listener" sound advice and I always listened to what the trainees had to say and I learned from that how to tailor my training to them

 

Rog

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On 05/11/2017 at 7:28 PM, Jill Sparrow said:

From what I've seen, literacy, numeracy and basic general knowledge are way below the standards expected of those who left school in the 50s to 70s.

 

I think part of the problem is that teachers are no longer able to teach in the way they once did, often due to disruptive pupils and having to adopt the roles of social worker, counsellor, riot police, etc. 

 

Certainly, where I was educated, it was a case of toe the line or expulsion...not that I was that lucky! Disruption wasn't tolerated and the aim of our education was to fit us for society in the capacity of employment but also to be able to converse with anyone of any age or background on any subject as an equal, without showing ourselves up.

 

This^^^

 

Then add in a percentage, sometimes high, sometimes low, of pupils with English not their first language to exacerbate the problem.

 

Schools concentrating on inclusivity and diversity instead of teaching, all men are NOT created equally.

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It should never be forgotten either that teaching is a two way street. You learn as much, if not more, than you teach others.

 

When I was about to go to teacher training college, many years ago now, someone gave me a piece of advice. "Remember," he said "that for every person who wants to teach, there are 30 people who don't want to learn...much!"  Cynic!

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I guess we should be grateful for the education we recieved and hopefully the young people of today also learn how to be good people with constructive ideas for the benefit of others, I did say "Hopefully"

 

Rog

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To think independently and read between the lines.  To question the official narrative is to be labeled a 'conspiracy theorist' today.  That is designed to make you shut up.

 

Some such theories are plainly nuts, but there are a few that should give us all pause to think.  Some who are remembered with respect today were considered nuts in their day.

 

Rog........ Don't hold your breath.  ;)

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Spent last ten years of my teaching career as a special needs teacher and by far the best years. Jill was right in saying so many do not want to learn but a child with special needs wants to learn.  What ever their age and needs thay all want to learn, there is nothing better than sitting with a child reading a book minutes after they wanted to kick or bite you. I still see my pupils and their parents, so lovely when they remember you and still ask for a cuddle.

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In other words we are taught to believe what others tell us, I think thats what I mean

 

Rog

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I read an article today about a sixth former sent home for inapropriate clothing, teacher (male) did not say why it was inapropriate.  It brought to mind when my grandaughter was at school skirts had to be below the knee and could be measured at any time. I dropped her off to walk to school with her friends and watched them all roll their skirts over till short. Evidently this was done going to school and  again when going home stopped then getting into trouble wonder, if its still done today.

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