Anything Political

[DJ360 6,721]

Obviously I don't know the demands made by Mundella, but HP requirements were 'Do-able'.

 

-Approved jacket and tie, plus cap until yr 3. The rest was pretty much standard across all secondaries., such as grey or black trousers and 'proper' shoes. Grey or White shirts. 'Loud' socks were discouraged, but not a hanging offence. The school scarf was optional, my Grandma bought me one for Christmas...

 

A white cotton apron for science and woodwork/metalwork.  Most parents made them.

 

Two Rugby shirts. One in Blue and the other in house colours.

Blue Rugby shorts.

White 'gym' shorts.

White 'T' shirt.

White 'plimsolls'

Rugby Boots

 

And for cricket, which wasn't necessary until the spring. White Trousers and shirt..so halfway there..and ideally boots, but 'plimsolls' were acceptable.

 

A 12" rule, pencil, pen (not 'ball point') and a basic Geometry Set (Set Square, dividers, compasses etc.)

 

A Hymn Book, bought from school for 1s 6d

 

Some sort of bag. Most used Forces surplus haversacks in Army Drab or RAF Blue  Couple of bob from Wakefields.

 

I think that's it..., though a slide rule was optional and I got one much later... Not that I learned much from it.

 

Also worth noting that there was school 'Benevolent Fund' which discretely assisted really hard up students with the costs of school kit etc. A collection was made during Registration, once a week I think.

 

[loppylugs 8,427]

Late wife went to NGHS.  I think she got a decent education, but she never spoke too highly of it.

[DJ360 6,721]

19 minutes ago, Jill Sparrow said:

I passed the 11+ with a high enough score to prompt the head of Berridge to pressure my mother to allow me to sit the entrance exam for NGHS.

 

I was always in a world of my own back then and didn't understand the 'machinations', but my pal Nigel , from the grocer's round the corner, was exceptionally bright. He went through some sort of assessment for Nottm High School.. for a scholarship as I understood it. Another lad, who always struck me as a bit dim, also went through the same process and was offered a place.  I don't suppose the fact that his dad was an Inspector of Police, whilst Nigel's dad was a grocer..had the slightest influence on the outcome...

Eitherway.. Nige went to HP and then on to be a Dr of Consumer Psychology,  Senior University Lecturer etc. and still has an online presence.

 

https://jardindespsyches.co.uk/blog/

 

 

[Brew 5,409]

7 minutes ago, DJ360 said:

but HP requirements were 'Do-able'.

 

 

Col you said 'do-able' and the wider family contributed, good on them.

I can't remember what the requirements were only that a shop in town was to be the sole supplier of uniforms, sportswear etc and they were expensive. With five kids from 11 to 2 it was never going to happen.  

[DJ360 6,721]

I can see that.  I forget the name of the Uniform Supplier in Friar Lane.  They supplied the best quality jackets etc, but jackets could also be had from the co-op, for less.  They soon faded and became quite obvious but nobody I know looked down on the wearers. I don't recall snobbery of any sort during my time at HP.

As we emerged onto Gainsford Crs. and some of the Padstow lot emerged opposite, there was occasional banter, but nothing serious.  They decided to call us 'Cads'.  I don't know if they knew what it meant.

[Stuart.C 491]

Dixon and Parker was the school outfitters.

[DJ360 6,721]

That's the one!  I think also that Sisson and Parker were the big Stationers who supplied schools with exercise books etc.

[philmayfield 6,115]

Passing the High School entrance exam was just the first stage. This was followed by an interview with the headmaster. The parents were also interviewed.
The High School was my first choice at the 11+ stage but there were only a few non fee paying scholarships. High School, Mellish, West Bridgford and Carlton le Willows were my options. Mellish was the most convenient as it was only a short walk from Woodthorpe to Daybrook Station. Woodthorpe boys had their legs pulled by the Arnold lads as they thought we were posh but we then lived in a semi just off Buckingham Rd. so not that posh. We later moved to Park Rd. off Thackeray’s Lane and became posher. When we moved out into the countryside in ‘62 people thought we were going to the back of beyond!

[letsavagoo 961]

6 hours ago, Jill Sparrow said:

I passed the 11+ with a high enough score to prompt the head of Berridge to pressure my mother to allow me to sit the entrance exam for NGHS.

I ‘passed’ the 11+ and was invited to take the boys high school entrance exam. I didn’t get in and had to settle for Forest Field GS. Loathed it.

[PeverilPeril 3,279]

Well, I didn't take the 11+ or any O levels. Still did OK in a technical and commercial capacity though 

[LizzieM 9,507]

My Dad, born 1921 and living in Lenton, passed the exam to go to High Pavement but refused to go because he wanted to play football and not rugby.  He went to Cottesmore Boys, captained the school football team and also Nottingham Boys.  His parents were struggling financially in the 30s, with Grandad’s timber business collapsing, so I doubt they had an issue about their football-loving son deciding which school HE wanted to attend! 

[Oztalgian 3,271]

8 hours ago, DJ360 said:

Approved jacket and tie, plus cap until yr 3. The rest was pretty much standard across all secondaries., such as grey or black trousers and 'proper' shoes. Grey or White shirts.

Our school uniform had a navy blue blazer, blue or white shirts with grey trousers or skirts.

 

8 hours ago, DJ360 said:

A Hymn Book, bought from school for 1s 6d

Why anyone would need a hymn book I don't know as most only mumbled or said rhubarb, rhubarb. Morning assembly and god bothering was not popular in our school.

 

8 hours ago, DJ360 said:

though a slide rule was optional and I got one much later... Not that I learned much from it.

The main thing I learned using a slide rule was "order of magnitude" which stood me in good stead in later life with calculations and spreadsheets. 

[mary1947 2,079]

When my son was 13 we were ask to go and see his teacher, the teacher told us that he would like to put him in for his O' levels and his A levels as in know certain terms he would pass. Well we ask him about it and he was not interested. By the time he did leave school he only had maths O' level. Then along came the Y.T.S. he just utterly refused to go on it, One morning I was so fed up with him just getting out of his pit (bed) I picked up the Yellow page phone book. threw it at him and said go though all that book and find yourself a job. Well his friend said that they wanted people at there place, he applied and got the job which was panel wiring. One day he said to me that he wanted to go into the drawing office, how do I go about it mum? go into the office and speak with the man in charge, won't bore you with the rest but he now his an electric designer , partner in his firm , all I can say is some times life does not kick in until you are older,

[DJ360 6,721]

20 hours ago, Brew said:

Col you said 'do-able' and the wider family contributed, good on them.

I can't remember what the requirements were only that a shop in town was to be the sole supplier of uniforms, sportswear etc and they were expensive. With five kids from 11 to 2 it was never going to happen.  

 

Looking back the cost of a bit of school kit was a pittance compared to the cost of the education provided and probably even less when you consider that everybody had to have clothes to wear to school whatever.  The fact that some couldn't accept places because they couldn't afford the requisite 'kit' is scandalous..especially considerinig the 'egalitarian' motives of the 1944 Act. There really should have been some sort of formal system of assistance in place.

[philmayfield 6,115]

Both the Nottingham Boys’ and Girls’ High Schools had thriving second hand uniform shops on the school premises run by parents. Perhaps wealthier people are better at managing their finances?

[DJ360 6,721]

12 hours ago, Oztalgian said:

Why anyone would need a hymn book I don't know as most only mumbled or said rhubarb, rhubarb. Morning assembly and god bothering was not popular in our school.

 

Because possession of that Hymn Book was compulsory.

Everyone kept it permanently in the pocket of their jacket. It was smaller and thinner than an average paperback and had a pale blue cover. It was also normal practice to keep your timetable taped to the inside rear cover. I can see the timetable now.. hand drawn little boxes representing each period with the subject, room and teacher's initials in each.

As for religion. I just went along with it without any real faith and I have to say I absolutely loved the annual Carol Service at the High Pavement Chapel from which the school originated. Stan Middleton who was a very good organist as well as English teacher and  Booker Prize winning novelist, always kept us entertained before the service started. The chapel was always very warm and 'Christmassy' and as well as formal singing etc.. we were often entertained by upper school 'folk singing' type lads, with guitars and 'popular' Christmas songs.  It really used to mark the start of Christmas for me.

[philmayfield 6,115]

I’ve just been into the library to check (I know it sounds pretentious but we do have a room with lots of books so we call it ‘the library’) and I’ve found my old school hymn book, ‘The Public School Hymn Book’. Now that was pretentious! I was latterly in the choir (god knows why) so I had a much larger hymn book with musical notation. I must have returned that one. No charge was made for our hymn books though.

[letsavagoo 961]

I realise that many of these comments are a continuation of a theme but they don’t really belong in the political thread. Do they? 

[DJ360 6,721]

On 2/27/2024 at 10:05 PM, LizzieM said:

This discussion is really interesting.  I passed the 11+ and went to Grammar School, although I was never in the A stream and left after ‘O’ Levels for the only reason that I wanted money in my pocket and didn’t fancy 2 more years of school and maybe 3 years of University. In fact at C-Le-W GS all the kids who went on to Uni appeared to study Medicine or went to Teacher Training College, neither appealed to me. 
Moving on about 15 years and our eldest son went to the local primary school in Bedfordshire.  He was doing ok but he was a shy little lad. The school sent a letter home announcing that there would soon be 38 kids in his class.  We made the decision that he would drown in that class and went searching for a Prep school for him. He and his little brother, who was nearly 5, started the next term and they loved it. It was the best decision we’ve made for our boys. They moved on up to the main school and then to University. It’s cost us many thousands of pounds but so worth it for the education, sport and the friendships and networking that have remained even now when they’re well into their forties.  We feel we made the right decision for our kids to have the same opportunities that we had for FREE at a State Grammar School in the 50s and 60s.   

And now the next generation of our clan is at an Independent Prep School and thriving.  But if Starmer has his way (when he gets in) the fees will go up another 20%.  No doubt causing already struggling parents to move their offspring into already over-subscribed state schools.  A politics of envy.  

 

Lizzie, I'm not sure where the 'envy' comes in.

Nobody on here, me included, is saying you don't have the right to pay for private education. I also recognise that some will have little problem paying fees running into thousands, whilst others might have to make considerable sacrifice to do so.

However, the vast majority simply don't have the 'wherewithall' to 'go private', however much they might want to, and in any case we are all entitled to ask Govt. why it becomes necessary at all?

It's not difficult to show that funding for state schools fell by around 8% after the Tories gained power in 2010 and that subsequent increases in funding have barely, if at all, been enough to repair the damage.  Meanwhile many schools are quite literally falling apart.

 

My main issue though, is that of 'Charitable Status'. I simply cannot see how a school which charges fees in order to provide Private education, can in any sense be seen as a 'Charity'.

 

From the Guardian:

 

Quote

The Tories’ defences for maintaining charitable status were paper thin. The education secretary, Gillian Keegan, said ending tax breaks was the “policy of envy” and could prompt many fee-paying schools to scale back the number of bursaries and scholarships they offer. But data shows that schools’ “financial assistance” is actually considerably more likely to go to affluent, middle-class families than disadvantaged ones. To object to this is not envy: it’s decency. Meanwhile, Rishi Sunak argued the move would be an attack on the “hard-working aspiration of millions of people” – despite the fact that the average annual fee for day pupils at independent schools is £15,191, around half the average UK salary before tax, and far beyond what most of us can “aspire” to.

 

 

 

 

 

[DJ360 6,721]

Back onto much more important Political issues.

 

I invite anyone interested, to have a look at the last few pages of a long running thread elsewhere, on the subject of:

 

'The Rise of the Far Right'

 

I'm not saying I agree with every word by any means, but I have been trying to raise awareness of what I see as a real threat to our Democracy, for years. 

Look at the antics of Truss and her association with the criminal Steve Bannon.. just the tip of the iceberg. Add in Lee Anderson and all those like Mogg etc., who are 'presenters' on  the appalling GB 'News' , which is constantly under investigation by Ofcom for wrongdoing, misinformation etc.

 

https://pinkfishmedia.net/forum/threads/the-rise-of-the-far-right.216596/page-102

 

What does the team think?

 

 

 

[Brew 5,409]

It's a shambles of half arsed rhetoric. 

 

It starts with a somewhat arrogant and slightly hysterical piece by Ashworth (L) Which leads the site admin to say:

 

"The Conservative Party now find themselves nothing left to sell but the visceral racism and manufactured division of fascism wrapped up in any number of crackpot conspiracy theories"

 

A quote which in itself is to my mind a crackpot theory.

 

The Truss/Bannon set is so far out I had to check if it's true, it is, and it's amazing they can spew this garbage with a straight face.

Bannon led her by the nose throughout cutting across her with leading questions and comments.  We should be grateful and count out blessings she was thrown out on her ear. I'm sure she needs professional help.

But it worries me more she was elected in the first place. 

 

One comment I sort of agree with is the failure of the left and centre left (though not only those), to present a decent, strong opposition and  viable alternatives over a long period of time; a sentiment that didn't go down well with other members who presented entirely irrelevant facts in arguments that amounted to a typical left leaning "it's never our fault"

 

Another quote:

"Brilliant plan. When fascism rears its ugly head, instead of resisting, blame the left, thus playing into the fascist's narrative."

 

We can hardly expect the far right to object, he seems to think the left is exempt, so does he expected that only the centre right to do the resisting? Does he not realise the right is rising within the ranks of the working class;  that the right wing influence has pulled Labour away from the absolutism of the Corbyn/Momentum/Militant eras and produced a watered down barrister to lead them?

 

I can't really get into the rest, it doesn't challenge the history or the root or the reasons of the rise of the right, they simply accept it is as is before descending into frenzied  criticism of the last ten years and present government.

 

They've simply latched onto a catchy title with which to polish their ego's..

 

 

[Brew 5,409]

And from the rise of the right to the rise of the radical...

[philmayfield 6,115]

Will Col be dancing in the street today? 

[Alpha 176]

Whoever attempts to govern this once greater country and from whatever political spectrum they represent, I seriously doubt this country will ever achieve what has been lost. Indecisiveness, incompetence, corruption and weakness are just a few traits that have drawn the country down into the mire of bankruptcy and poverty we are becoming used to today.

 

The wokeists, the fanatical mutants and the ever-present handwringing snivelling ‘do gooders’ have been allowed to thrive and spawn so we have lost control of our nationality, pride, moral conduct and the tenacity to stand up and confront these anti-nationalists and other global threats with dignity and conviction.

 

All forms of governments have treated drugs and crime, in general, as school boy antics where to day our streets are being taken over by unchallenged murderers, criminals and the where the ever growing anti-social element face little, if any justice, for their crime.

 

Bring back terminal punishment, closed borders and strength of will over uncontrolled immigration and just do something!

[Jill Sparrow 10,304]

28 minutes ago, philmayfield said:

Will Col be dancing in the street today? 

Don't think that would do his bad knee much good.