DJ360 6,712 Posted July 16, 2022 Report Share Posted July 16, 2022 The fact that she is trying to emulate possibly the most hated British politician of all time says rather a lot about how in touch she is. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Brew 5,378 Posted July 16, 2022 Report Share Posted July 16, 2022 Perhaps not explained myself well. Ignoring who did what and why the economy from the mid-eighties climbed steadily to a peak in 2008 then the crash. And whether we agree with the why and how, it started to recover at a similar pre-crash rate until covid. Both Labour and Tory policies produced a similar result in growth. In 2019 GDP per capita was a tad in front of Japan and France and unemployment is less than half that of the latter. Taking all that happened, much beyond our control, I can't say I agree with 'mismanagement'. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Brew 5,378 Posted July 16, 2022 Report Share Posted July 16, 2022 41 minutes ago, Cliff Ton said: Not my creation, but an interesting comparison. Different people will have different views on the degree of similarity. She's not the first to emulate the look of someone they admire. Corbyn, with a 'Shoreditch market' hat, and beard was accused of copying Trotsky's look. And wiggy Fabricant, possibly the greatest lickspittle in modern times... They will deny it of course, and put it down to 'mere coincidence'. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DJ360 6,712 Posted July 18, 2022 Report Share Posted July 18, 2022 On 7/16/2022 at 10:52 AM, Brew said: Perhaps not explained myself well. Ignoring who did what and why the economy from the mid-eighties climbed steadily to a peak in 2008 then the crash. And whether we agree with the why and how, it started to recover at a similar pre-crash rate until covid. Both Labour and Tory policies produced a similar result in growth. In 2019 GDP per capita was a tad in front of Japan and France and unemployment is less than half that of the latter. Taking all that happened, much beyond our control, I can't say I agree with 'mismanagement'. Thing is Jim, it all depends upon how you define a 'well managed' economy, and who exactly it is being managed for. I'm drawing here on a couple of things I learned many years ago. 1. It is entirely possible to have a successful national economy which huge numbers of the population neither participate in, nor benefit from. 2. Growth is by no means the only metric on which an economy should be judged and there have long been economic arguments around the fundamental insanity of a finite World in which continuous economic growth is pursued as a 'holy grail'. 3. Reductions in taxation, (especially Direct Taxation) are of course built in to Tory ideology, but within the current tax structure of the UK, they always disproportionately benefit the more wealthy. Cutting tax for those who barely pay any and yet still struggle to exist, is just a cruel joke. The present bunch of Wannabe Prime Ministers, have mostly argued for Tax Cuts and even where they disagree on timing, they see low tax small state as the way forward. They still insist, despite evidence here and World wide to thecontrary, that their approach will bring wider prosperity, via 'trickle down' effects. It just won't. It never has and never will. Direct policy intervention, such as actually levelling up rather than just blathering on about it, is what is needed, to halt, and reverse, the ever increasing wealth gap and North South Divide. I don't see any chance of that happening under the 'leadership', of a bunch of nobodies who hung on to Johnson's coat tails until his obvious vote losing antics forced them all into a 'Road to Damascus' conversion and an outbreak of 'integrity' of embarrassing proportions. And of course while they have been arguing about how best to implement their narrow ideology, I'm pretty sure that not one of them has mentioned the near collapse of the Ambulance Service, the chronic understaffing of the NHS, food banks, etc.,etc. All of these were of course revealed, or exacerbated by Brexit and Covid, but neither were caused by it. They were caused by deliberate neglect of training, recruitment etc. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
radfordred 6,284 Posted July 18, 2022 Report Share Posted July 18, 2022 Can anyone tell me if this Tom Tugendhat fellow served in the army? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jill Sparrow 10,267 Posted July 18, 2022 Report Share Posted July 18, 2022 TA, I think. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Stuart.C 483 Posted July 18, 2022 Report Share Posted July 18, 2022 From Wiki, assuming correct; Thomas Georg John Tugendhat[2] MBE VR (born 27 June 1973) is a British politician. A member of the Conservative Party, he has served as Chairman of the Foreign Affairs Committee since 2017. Tugendhat has been the Member of Parliament (MP) for Tonbridge and Malling since 2015.[3] Before entering politics, he worked as a journalist and as a public relations consultant in the Middle East. He also had a part-time role as an officer in the British Army reserves, the Territorial Army; he served in the Iraq War and the Afghanistan War. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Brew 5,378 Posted July 18, 2022 Report Share Posted July 18, 2022 5 hours ago, DJ360 said: Growth is by no means the only metric on which an economy should be judged and there have long been economic arguments around the fundamental insanity of a finite World in which continuous economic growth is pursued as a 'holy grail'. Not the only means, but GDP is universally accepted as the premier indicator of economic success or failure, second is CPI, but there are far more variables with that. Anything else simply comes down to differences of opinion. Low taxes, as you rightly point out, do not lead to growth, and trickle down doesn't trickle anywhere they think it should. Levelling up is a pipe dream. Every PM in living memory has acknowledged the North/South divide, and despite grand words and unviable schemes (Blair's 'northern power house' sound familiar?), have failed comprehensively to change it. The wannabes are ignoring the Elephants (plural). An NHS not fit for purpose. Food banks in the sixth-richest country on the planet. The cost of living that is out of control. The NI border dispute, and though it may not be PC to mention it, virtually unchecked illegal immigration. What are they arguing about? Mainly tax because they think voters want to hear it, and last week it seemed that even gender identification was a major bone to be chewed over! Petulant Sunak and Truss are refusing to appear on TV because it becomes a slanging match… I wonder who's responsible for that? The situation is rapidly descending into a farce. And what has Starmer come up with today? "Why has Johnson failed to prepare the country for the heatwave"! Seriously? That's all the criticism he can come up with? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
philmayfield 6,089 Posted July 18, 2022 Report Share Posted July 18, 2022 Labour did appoint Dennis Howell as a minister for rain after a drought in the 70’s and it p***ed down not long after his appointment. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Brew 5,378 Posted July 18, 2022 Report Share Posted July 18, 2022 Yeah, and didn't we also have American Indians or some sort of shaman do a rain dance? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
philmayfield 6,089 Posted July 18, 2022 Report Share Posted July 18, 2022 Our hay's being mown this Thursday. I don't want any of those rain making rituals happening until it's been baled and carted away! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
radfordred 6,284 Posted July 18, 2022 Report Share Posted July 18, 2022 It's obvious you did not watch last night's live TV debate @Stuart.C if only Owd Tom could have had another hour I'm liking Ms Mordaunt for PM Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Brew 5,378 Posted July 20, 2022 Report Share Posted July 20, 2022 Announced today is approval for a new nuclear power station. Cost is estimated at 20bn, a lot of money and mainly funded by the French (EDF). With almost the same size, some say bigger, economy, how come they can afford it, and we can't? Why do we have to be beholding to foreign powers for our energy? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Brew 5,378 Posted July 20, 2022 Report Share Posted July 20, 2022 "Never give up, never surrender". Boris claims his mission is 'largely finished'............. for now! I wonder what he has in mind next? Apart from his million pound book deal, what is he plotting for the future? He sabotaged Theresa May, can he outsmart Sunak? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Brew 5,378 Posted July 25, 2022 Report Share Posted July 25, 2022 I may have dreamed this, have I just read that a significant number want Johnson to retract his resignation? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Beekay 5,094 Posted July 25, 2022 Report Share Posted July 25, 2022 Can we really be that lucky Brew? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
philmayfield 6,089 Posted July 25, 2022 Report Share Posted July 25, 2022 Can't be any worse than the two contenders! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cliff Ton 10,435 Posted July 25, 2022 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2022 1 hour ago, Brew said: I may have dreamed this, have I just read that a significant number want Johnson to retract his resignation? A significant number of who/what ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Brew 5,378 Posted July 25, 2022 Report Share Posted July 25, 2022 I've read two quotes in the press. One said 65%, the other 85%, preumably of those conservative memebers able to vote in the election. The Mirror is quoting 'thousands', The Telegraph and Huffingfon Post are also reporting similar... I don't think it can happen, but it seems some members want his name on the ballot paper in order to re-elect him as leader. Perhaps he'll emulate Trump and storm parliament! Just as there was a rush to register for the Labour leadership, there is something similar happening for the Conservatives. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
philmayfield 6,089 Posted July 25, 2022 Report Share Posted July 25, 2022 As a former Conservative I no longer know which party to support next time. It's a sorry state of affairs. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Brew 5,378 Posted July 25, 2022 Report Share Posted July 25, 2022 6 minutes ago, philmayfield said: As a former Conservative I no longer know which party to support next time. It's a sorry state of affairs. Join the Liberals, I'm sure there's still room on the fence. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
philmayfield 6,089 Posted July 25, 2022 Report Share Posted July 25, 2022 I'm not sure what they stand for but I gather they're a bit lefty. Nearby Southwell, oddly enough, seems to be a place for Lib. voters judging by the posters at election times. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Brew 5,378 Posted July 25, 2022 Report Share Posted July 25, 2022 4 hours ago, philmayfield said: I'm not sure what they stand for Nor is anyone else..... including the Liberals Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Oztalgian 3,218 Posted September 5, 2022 Report Share Posted September 5, 2022 Looking at the UK press and reading about the cost increases in energy, food and groceries and other goods and services. I can sympathise with anyone on a fixed income but what is/can your new glorious do about it? Back in 1972 inflation was 7.13% and mortgage interest rates were 7.38%. I cannot recall a massive plea for government assistance for cost of living or did I miss it because I was too busy working all the overtime I could just to pay for the shopping, my gas and electric bills and the mortgage? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
philmayfield 6,089 Posted September 5, 2022 Report Share Posted September 5, 2022 The economic situation is serious but it’s the tendency of the media to hype up every situation into a catastrophe these days. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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