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"... I came across this picture of a K1, taken at York Roundhouse again, June 66. Not all that common in the Nottingham area..."

Certainly rare in our part of the world...

Saw them occasionally passing through Bingham on the early morning Donny-Colwick pick up freight...the trip certainly produced the ultimate visitor when Fort William's K1/1 MacCaillin Mor turned up one day! The working took the Cotham/Kilvington route from Newark Northgate, joining the Grantham-Nottingham line at Bottesford West Jct.

Cheers

Robt P.

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Managed to buy 4 plates in '68 from a schoolmaster friend who had acquired 20 (!) from Derby Works for their brass weight. Paid £70 for Malay States, Queensland, Hood & North Borneo. Idiot that

Hopefully this will be a picture of the last northbound steam special, perhaps some of you recognise yourselves The last southbound York-Bournemouth is the train on the left.

A topic about old Nottm railway stations might interest a few of the train buffs on here !   http://www.nottinghampost.com/news/history/lost-railway-stations-nottingham-220673

I've got some work to do today, Woo Hoo, so I'll be quiet.

I'm going to publish my favourite and rarest photo now before I get into it.

Father would inevitably have some cunning plan if it was going to be a nice day. Early one warm sunny saturday, it was in fact June 20th 1959, sandwiches were packed, probably the inevitable fish paste, you know, that stuff in the small glass jars, a flask of coffee, a bottle of orange squash and probably some of mothers home made cake, perhaps even a box of Smiths crisps, available from Wollaton Co-op in a red and blue striped box and contained within grease proof paper, I doubt it, we didn't have much money and they were a real extravagance, I may have been indulged with a packet of Nibbits, remember them.

No doubt having spent the previous evening servicing the tandem to perfection, we set off early in the morning, father on the front as usual, my 15 year old brother with his Kodak Brownie camera on the back and me on the little red seat on the crossbar in the middle, what a combination.

Travelling up the cycle path on Western Boulevard, we went up to Red Hill, cut across to Calverton, struggled up Oxton Hill and ended up at Southwell. In those days Southwell still had a station connected to Rolleston Junction, this is what we came across in the platform, but I'll save that for later.

Afterwards we cycled across country to Carlton On Trent, found an appropriate field and sat by the ECML, father reckoned that as it was such a straight piece of track, that the trains would be coming past at a hell of a speed. He was right, they did, my brothers poor camera couldn't cope with it, what would I have given for my digital camcorder that day.

A great time, sitting in a meadow of wildflowers on a perfect summers day watching every LNER Pacific going, hurtling past as fast as they dare.

I remember coming back on a different route because of a particular pub he liked, I can picture it, but haven't a clue where it was, somewhere near Southwell, I recall calling in there again on a Skills mystery trip.

Those were the days, no doubt we wobbled all the way home.

I had a fantastic childhood and many adventures, my parents didn't have a lot of money but made what they had count for the good of us all, I had a great time, I'll never forget what they did for us.

Anyway, here you go, the Southwell branch push-pull train, I have a massive clock in my garage that is supposed to be off the Rolleston Junction Southwell branch platform, I don't know how I can prove it.

sw1.jpg

Priceless isn't it.

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Ah, the Southwell "Paddy" as it was known locally. Before my time, regrettably.

Regarding your clock, I might just know someone who would be able to verify its provenance. There's an old chap in Thurgarton, my home village, who's well known in railway circles, he's restored the old St. Pancras clock on his barn wall.

Chap's name is Roland Hoggard, he's well into his nineties now but when I last heard quite sprightly. What he doesn't know about Midland and LMS railway clocks isn't worth knowing.

When I was a kid, back in the 1960's, Roland had the Y7 0-4-0T , BR number 68088 stored in his barn. The loco gave many years of service on GCR, and is now at the North Norfolk Railway.

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Roland became famous when St Pancras was re-opened, I gather he rescued the clock after it had been dropped many years ago and stashed it away in the guards van on the next train back to Nottingham Midland.

There was a photo of him and the clock in his somewhat overgrown yard in Thurgaton in the Sunday Times, at least the 'powers that be' let him keep it and used it as a template for a copy, their excuse being that it was too fragile to move it.

I didn't know he had rescued 68088. I know it was withdrawn from Stratford Works in the 50's and used by the NCB at Bentick Colliery for many years, he must have obtained it from there.

The NNR are currently restoring it to working order, though I doubt whether it will be powerful enough to pull any of their trains up the gradient at Kelling Heath.

Thats reminded me of another steam loco that was stashed away privately in the early 60's.

This was a narrow gauge tank loco, quite a big one, which was parked outside someones garage on a modern housing estate near the site of Watnall Hall. We used to be members of the Nottingham Trolleybus Group and somebody tipped us off about it so we cycled up there and had a look.

Can anyone else remember it and where it went to, I doubt whether it's still there after all these years, but who knows.

Which has reminded me of something else, what happened to the saddle tank that was stuck outside London Road High Level Station for many years, has it gone to Ruddington.

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Nottingham Trolley Bus Group? did you know Mr Farnsworth?

Our Ted, indeed I did, he lived in a terraced house on Rosetta Road with his young wife and baby, how did you know him then. Perhaps I should start a Nottingham Trolleybus Group thread, wheres me photos.

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firbeck,

"The Lincolnshire aviation tour" was yesterday 25th, I'm sure there will be plenty of pictures posted for everyone to see, so get your pics ready, there was plenty of historical stuff yesterday as well as a lot of the latest in the shape of the Typhoon who put on a splendid display for us, also on the agenda was a bit of railway history and redundant lines for the benefit of Rob237 although no pictures were taken of these I can soon get some sorted if you or Rob want.

It was a day I will remember for the excellent company and conversation, aviation history, and of course the food.

Rog !cheers!

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Many thanks to Ian and Rog for their company on the Lincolnshire Air/Bird/Rail/Ham & eggs/Bomber County ale/Frostbite excursion...enjoyed it all immensely.

Despite:

1) Ian braking to a rapid halt from his usual speed...as he had spotted a squadron of rare McDonnell-Douglas quail in a distant field...looked like a thrush to me...

2) Capt Oates wandering around the Waddington viewing compound, as we arrived...he seemed to be lost and cold.

3) Rog selecting a parking spot (in an empty car park, and in a rainstorm) 1,000 yards from the venue's door...

4) My permanent deafness made even worse by a Typhoon take off in vertical mode...

Already looking forward to next years excursion, when hats, gloves and scarves won't be so vital.

Lunch at the Bell Inn please...

Slept like a log last night...too much fresh air!

Cheers

Robt P.

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Fair enough, but I know I can be a bit of a gob sometimes, but this is supposed to be a railway thread, what do you think of my last pics, I hate publishing and getting no feed back, I'm not looking for praise, just a few related comments.

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Come on, be fair...I've already responded to your K1 and A4 pics above, in detail.

Do you agree with my A4 identity assessment?

Could also tell you a tale about Clifford Castle, but was loathe to post too many seperate observations together.

Wonder if the well known 90 year clock is still in use on Northgate's down platform?

It was just a couple of years back...

Did you know that infamous Top Shed top-link driver Bill Hoole never carried a watch, but always used the prominent suspended station clocks - common to the ECML - to check his progress, as he sped through?

There have been numerous earlier threads, with many contibutions, on Nottingham Trolleybuses...can't find em, as yet!

Cheers

Robt P.

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Our Ted, indeed I did, he lived in a terraced house on Rosetta Road I didn't know that, so did I! well address was Nottingham Road but entrance on Rosetta, I met him when he lived on Basford Road Old Basford, his son John was sound engineer with the band, didn't Ted drive the last trolley bus? a no.36 if memory serves me right?

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Come on, be fair...I've already responded to your K1 and A4 pics above, in detail.

Do you agree with my A4 identity assessment.

Cheers

Robt P.

Sorry mate, it's my birthday today and it's sparked off many reminisances and stories inside my head, it's never bothered me before, but for some reason it has today, why, I don't know. I'm very far removed from friends and family, it hasn't helped by piling through my picture box, on the other hand its kicked me into gear to phone up an old pal in Underwood who shares the same birthdate, we've just been having a somewhat nervous laugh together. My mother has gone off for some eye treatment today, I've been worried about this as well, I'm sure she'll be Ok, a day I will be quite thankfull to see the end of, it kicked me in the guts as soon as I woke up, my lovely dog having epiletic fits last night and at this moment doesn't help.

I have to remove my drawings from the dining room table now, I'm apparently in for a feast tonight.

Good old Liz.

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Happy birthday...cheer up, a day to be positive and forward looking!

[sez me, who moped through my last birthday...]

I'm sure your special meal will brighten matters for you...take care.

Cheers

Robt P.

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Thanks mate, the candle lit meal certainly cheered me up, she replicated Gordon Ramsays 70's cookalong, it was a right laugh, especially when I nearly flambeyed the kitchen and my eyebrows. Lot's of loud music from the past too and out came the guitars as well, it's a good job old Dot next door is a bit deaf.

Anyway, I'm going to start a Trolleybus Group thread now, and no, Ted Farnsworth didn't drive the last trolleybus, problem is, my trolleybus memorabilia seem to be elsewhere, I can't find the tickets, articles, photos and, sharp intake of breath, the starting handle off the last trolleybus, it must be all somewhere, probably in another box, so you'll have to make do with what I've managed to find until the weekend.

Over to the new thread.

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A few facts I found from 1942 relating to railways in uk (the big 4 LMS LNER SR and GWR)

Total no. of steam locos 19,577

" " " diesel " 35

Total carriages 42,575

" wagons 646.479

Road passenger vehicles 15,000

" goods " 10,367

plus 11,163 Horses, 24,832 Horse wagons

Passenger Stations 6,698 Goods Stations 6,908, Signal boxes 10,220

Tunnels 1,049 House owned 49,774 Staff 555,337

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Blimey Ashley, what a fascinating load of figures, where did you get them from, what makes it intriguing is that they were put together in the middle of the War, I reckon that they must have been way understaffed, it would be interesting to know, compared to peace time, how many female staff were employed and how different things were in say 1938 or 1946.

Things were very fluid then, we were about to get an influx of steam engines from the USA, the system was being subject to attack from the Luftwaffe, I think we got off very lightly, an A4, Sir Ralph Wedgewood was destroyed in an air attack on York Sheds and no doubt lesser high profile locos were also destroyed, but compared to what we were dishing out on the occupied continent, I think we got away with it.

No mention of electric stock, the Southern was well preoccupied with this at the time, but there were other electric systems in Liverpool, and I don't mean the overhead railway, and systems up in the North East. The Woodhead route electrification was planned and the first loco 26000 possibly built by then.

The railways around London Road were bombed, but I suspect that they were brought back into line very quickly, over to those with more knowledge.

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Very interesting stats Ashley. The almost complete absence of diesel powered locos is a sad indictment of the railway industry's technological myopia in the interwar period.

In 1938 Movietone was trumpeting Mallard as a triumph of British engineering but compared with what the Americans were introducing she was a technological Dodo.

GM's 1939 offering

th_GMFT.jpg

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1942 Whitaker's Almanck, they also owned 130 Steamships and 76 Docks Harbours and Wharves, no figures regarding hotels etc owned but close examination of a 1900/1901 map posted on Nottstalgia reveals Moorgreen Reservoir was owned by The Great Northern Railway! As regards Nottingham Bomb Damage to the railways I seem to recall seeing a picture of the LMS sheds wrecked in the meadows? plus of course The NSR was hit (and never repaired) where it crossed The Midland Tracks near Trent Lane

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Bamber

It's true that the USA produced these wonderful diesel technological advances, but on the other hand, they had vast oil reserves while we had a few nodding donkeys at Eakring. Our industry at the time could't compare, it was based on coal and trying to drag itself out of the 1920's recession and the 19th century. We were also thrown into 1930's European political intrigue, the Spanish Civil War, the possibilities of inevitable war with Germany. We had to play it safe and deal with what we had. Don't knock Mallards achievements, they were remarkable, there was nothing wrong with steam power at the time, we had got the technology off to a tee, why change what we had proved to be a winner, we had coal mines not oil wells, what were we supposed to do.

In the 60's the American railway system was still relying on these pre war gems, but we left them far behind, what price the Burlington Zephyr when we had HST and such advanced technology that they hadn't kept up with, yes, I know that in the case of the tilting train, we had problems, but politics decided the outcome, the powers that be weren't prepared to put money into solving the problem.

Did you know that Amtrak wanted to buy HST to run between Los Angeles and San Fransisco because their technology died and couldn't cope with what the Europeans were producing. Sad isn't it, we now buy our locos from Canada, Spain, Germany, and the new Javelins from Japan, thank you Mrs Thatcher for starting the rot in our home industries, politics shouldn't be brought into this, but she has a lot to answer for.

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The Sneinton area was quite badly hit in the Nottingham blitz and the railways were quite likely the targets for the bombs. From memory the carriage sidings near what we now call the Eastcroft were badly hit but worse damage was suffered by the LNWR Goods warehouse - this was still around in the 60's but the site is now covered by housing.

My fathers family were sheltering in the "shelter" in the the back garden but a bomb would have finished them all off. They were lucky but others in the district were not so fortunate. Particularly unlucky were some workers at the bakery on Meadow Lane shletering in the basement. Some of the last bombs of the night fell through the bakery roof and a number were killed, including at least one from my familys then street Cosby Road. Meanwhile my grandfather was out working in the blitz all night - as an ARP!

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re CWS Bakery and last bombs of night, I always assumed given bomb damage pattern they came in from the south east and and first bombs would be at meadow lane, NSR bridge etc then across the city? most northerly damage I know of that night was Masonic Hall on Goldsmith Street? who knows? Was told by old chap I used to work with who was 15 the night of the raid that an underground shelter on Dakyne Street got direct hit and according to him they never bothered digging it out, just levelled ground over debris and bodies, sounds far fetched but then again? Far as I know we lost 2 pubs that night, 1 was The Moot Hall, anyone know the other? (not that long built far as I know)

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