Memories of 2 Castle Place

[firbeck 859]

I was looking through the English Heritage register of Listed Buildings the other day and came across this picture of 2 Castle Place, or as they call it, Wyville House:

While clearly in good condition, it looks empty, is this still the case, has anyone been inside it recently, are there plans to occupy it, lot's of questions.

This is where I spent my entire working career in Nottingham from 1970 to 1976 when it was occupied by the post office below and our company, Royle and Whitehorn Architects, above. Here's a photo from Picture the Past taken in the 60's just before I worked there, yet exactly as I remember it:

You can see the post office, at the time the only source of Robin Hood memorabilia, nobody, including the Castle across the road took any interest in promotion, as a consequence, it was packed out with tourists all the time, the postmaster was a tall, balding chap wearing glasses, a bit aloof and lacking a sense of humour, I can't for the life of me recall his name and I used to see him nearly everyday for 6 years, without his sense of duty and promotion of the legend, the tourists would have been lost as nobody else cared, mind you, he must have made a fortune out of it, a tiny shop that was packed from the minute he opened to the minute he closed, why was it shut down, it must have been the most profitable post office in the country.

The room above the post office was occupied by E Vernon Royle, the senior partner in the firm and a wonderful, eccentric character, that I gather is still alive and must be in his 90's now.

The top room was occupied by John Whitehorn, his partner, some considered him to be a dour, humourless man, but I was his personal assistant and boy, did we have some adventures and laughs together.

Here's another picture of the place taken in the 1940's:

According to Picture the Past, the top floors were occupied by C G Lake & Co embroiderers, not true.

Wyville House was a classical 18th century residence, in the Crimean War it was converted into a hospital, details of the ghost of Nurse Hancock will be published if you wish me to provide more info on the place.

Frank Broadhead, emminent architect took the place over after WW1, after WW2 he formed a partnership with E V Royle, then on Franks retirement, Our Vern formed a partnership with J E Whitehorn that lasted until 1982.

I left in 1976, after that I know very little about the place, I have some great tales to tell if anyone is interested, I'd love to know whether anyone dealt with us, knows anything about the company, etc etc.

For such a small firm, we did some incredible projects, Diocesian Architects, NCC stuff that they couldn't handle and all of Home Breweries stuff, anyone interested in more details, I didn't get a lot of money when I worked there, but the experience and fun was beyond belief.

[jokeeffe9 0]

Hi Firbeck,

I am a student at Nottingham Trent Uni and I am currently doing a project on 2 Castle Place
I wondered if there is anything else you can tell me about the building and what it was like for you to work there.
The property is currently vacant and I cannot find any more information on the internal space online so I would be very grateful for anything you can tell me.

Kind regards,

jokeefe9

[catfan 14,793]

More please Pete.

[firbeck 859]

Hi

The amazing projects in Nottinghamshire designed in that building were unbelievable, all this stuff was designed by a very small staff. E Vernon Royle was the senior architect, he was very eccentric, yet he'd been on the RIBA panel with Sir Basil Spence. I recall him wandering into the drawing office one afternoon and asking me to draw up the garden wall at Tollerton Rectory. The survey was written down on the back of an old piece of Xmas paper and measured out with his umbrella and pipe, these two objects being left with me for reference. In charge of the drawing office, consisting of just me, was Bill Spray MSAAT, a lovely man aged about 40, quite old fashioned and having to put up with this long haired 1970's rebel. We had a few 'establishment' clashes, but he was a wonderful bloke, couldn't have had a finer teacher.

I became the assistant to the other partner John Whitethorn. Through him I dealt with all the local authority design jobs, which were very significant. He was considered to be a miserable old bugger, but when you got to know him, we had some right laughs together.

I recall Thatcher opening one of my school extensions at Aslockton, he was invited, I wasn't. He went ballistic, threatening all sorts against Notts County Council for not inviting me. I told him not to bother as I didn't want to meet her anyway. He got his own back by deliberately unblocking a backed up foul drain at Stapleford Fire Station during the grand opening civic ceremony, we were both crying with laughing over that one.

Our secretary was Miss Stanton, she was in her 70's and the word battleaxe clearly applied. She lived in a house in West Bridgeford with her twin sister and they hadn't spoken to each other since the war. You did not mess with her at all but I used to wind her up something rotten with dead mice, plastic dog poo from the joke shop, anything I could think of, the partners used to put on a straight face on my behalf and say nothing.

She always had a hard done to assistant that was normally quite glam, we used to keep them sane. I recall one lovely girl was saving up to get married and Mr Royle used to allow her and her boyfriend to go in the office on a Saturday night so they could have a bit of private time together away from their parents, they must have had fun on the carpet in front of those 1940's gas fires.

I have many tales to tell, the next time you ever pass Seely Sherwood Lodge primary school near Bilsthorpe, wonder why there's a great bank of earth next to the sports field.

[firbeck 859]

The office was accessed through the grand front door leading into a stone floored passage with the post office entrance to the left. Another large door led into a small courtyard out the back. The office entrance was through a door with a fanlight to the left, the number of keys I needed to get into this complex was immense, almost leading to my arrest at a Forest match, but that's another story.

The lobby at the ground floor was large with a door to the cellars to the right of the very grand Queen Anne staircase. This went up two floors and was lit by a grand rooflight, nevertheless, it was dark and atmospheric down there.

At the top of the first flight EVR's office was to the right with a bay window overlooking the castle, all his furniture would probably cause gasps at the Antique Roadshow. Going through the door his ancient drawing board was on the left, his grand desk to the right, there were lovely engravings and old drawings on the walls. Back to the landing and there was a toilet at the head of the stairs, to be used by Miss Stanton, clients and EVR only, unless you were caught short.

Sorry, I have to nip out, more later.

[firbeck 859]

To the left at the top of the stairs was a door leading to 'reception', this was the domain of Miss Stanton. She sat sideways on at a desk against a bay window overlooking the rear courtyard, her assistant sat opposite, the desks pushed together and covered in ancient typewriters and our prewar inter office telephone system, there was a gas fire in a large fire place to the right.

Everywhere there were ancient chairs, it's a pity I wasn't into antique furniture in those days.

To the left was a door leading to an annexe that contained ancient and modern filing cabinets, go through there and you came to the drawing office.

This was a long room with glass fronted built in cupboards on the left, immediately before this was a small, notorious, haunted staircase. The right hand wall was fully glazed with Crittall Windows, the drawing boards arranged in open cubicles at right angles. Our boards were ancient, set on bricks at a slight angle, no parallel motion, we had t squares, I still have mine in the loft. This was Bill Spray's domain, he occupied the end cubicle. Behind him were the coat hooks then steps down to a tiny kitchen and toilet, the boiler was in the kitchen, it was ancient and could be run on gravity, the heating pipes around the office were of an enormous diameter.

Going back to the first floor landing, the main staircase led up to the top landing, there was situated another toilet and John Whitehorns office to the right. Unlike EVR's office, it was not cluttered and furnished very simply and in a more contemporary style. JEW was the modern thinker, he only thought in metric and provided us with the first electronic calculator and even a photocopier, it filled the printroom, but it was revolutionary, EVR didn't have anything to do with such things, he stuck to feet and inches and measuring up with his brolley.

On the left of the landing was the print room. There was a huge desk with an aluminium top to cut up prints, print paper was stored underneath, the dyeline printer was on the right, this great contraption operated by feeding in the tracing through a roller with the yellow print paper. After travelling around a glass tube with a UV light in it, the print paper was fed through a tray of hideously corrosive liquid and put out to dry, if you accidentally fed the tracing through this, it was ruined.

Along the left hand wall were racks going up to the ceiling, these contained all the old drawings, rolled up and tied with string. Next was a small lobby with the small staircase going down to the drawing office, off that was a small room which was used by JEW's personal secretary, the glamorous Linda, I used to feel sorry for her stuck in there on her own. Behind that was another small room used by Noel, the QS, he wasn't there long, he left not long after I started and wasn't replaced, his room was used to store old box files.

Below the building was a network of cellars accessed off the main entrance. The first level was under the post office and had a cellar window facing the castle. A series of rock steps led down to another bare sandstone hewn room, then to another one below that which had a bricked up entrance facing north.

I could go on, what other info would you like, how we coped with the great power cuts in 1974 was interesting, I'll leave that for another time.

[DAVIDW 1,681]

Interesting that you mention a Nurse Hancock in the above , using it as a hospital .

Looked in the news archives and at first just noticed adverts for various domestic staff from Page boys to Swiss French governesses , with replies to a Mrs Hancock at Wyville House .This was in the range of 1906 right up to 1920.

At first I thought they must be a really posh family but then noticed one of the adverts said "agency".

Checking on the census info , found a William Hancock (postmaster ) and a Charlotte Hancock (domestic agency) living there in 1891.

Previous census 1881, the couple were living elsewhere in Nottingham , he an upholsterer and she with the agency .

Going up to 1911 she is still at the address but a widow and described as "Governess and domestic agent" even though she is now in her 70s .

As mentioned previously there is a final advert for staff in 1920 and then in 1921 looks like the whole place is up for rent . Advertised as 4 rooms to the front and 4 to the rear with a 32' room within.

[firbeck 859]

An interesting slant on Miss Hancock, the legend I heard when I worked there was that she'd been a nurse when the building was used as Crimean War hospital which must have been 1853 to 56. If she was in her 70's in 1911, then it's possible she could have been a young nurse during that period, I had no idea that there was another connection with that name.

Certainly the building had an intense atmosphere about it, nobody was enthusiastic about staying in there alone after dark, I wasn't. EVR was alone in his office one dark night and told me he heard footsteps continually coming up the stairs and stopping outside his door, as the 'fortress' doors were all locked downstairs, he knew it wasn't a visitor. In the end he shouted at the top of his voice for them to 'Bugger Off!' He said it worked.

Bill Spray reckoned footsteps could be heard upstairs when no-one else was in, Miss Stanton had a few weird experiences too but wasn't bothered by it. The QS upstairs was a bit of a religious nut, he claimed the place was evil and nothing would get him to stay on his own.

I recall staying behind a few times, I didn't like it much, you imagined all sorts of things. The worst part was leaving and switching the lights off downstairs, you had to battle through the entrance and fiddle with all the locks on the post office door in the pitch darkness, it wasn't much fun.

[firbeck 859]

It was interesting how we coped with the enforced powercuts during the 1974 Miners Strike. As some of you will remember we had to operate a 3 day week enforced by power cuts in different parts of the city, it was a very strange experience coming home on the bus through huge areas of darkness.

At the time we were very busy, ironically I had deadlines on some large local authority projects. We realised that the ancient central heating boiler could be switched off from the electricity supply, started manually and left to run on gravity, the gas fires were no problem. We provided lighting with as many hurricane lamps, camping gas lamps and candles that we could all lay our hands on. Typewriters were no problem as they were manual, as for the print and copying machines, calculators, internal phone system, even the electric rubbers, we simply didn't use them on power off days. It sometimes got a bit difficult to draw when it got dark, but we managed, that was the time to dictate letters instead.

Our drawing office looked out over a small walled courtyard then there was a parking area off Castle Gate for a firm of Structural Engineers next door. We could see the side of the Fothergill Watson building opposite and behind that a brand new DHSS office. They had been provided with a large leisure room opposite us with table tennis facilities, it used to infuriate us as the same staff seemed to spend what seemed all day playing table tennis. When the blackouts started and we were grovelling about in the dark this Government Building was a blaze of lights. We assumed they must have had emergency generators but found out they hadn't. Eventually when all the lights came on in the 'leisure' room and a table tennis tournament started, Bill Spray went ballistic, he phoned up the DHSS, demanded to speak to the boss and asked how they had the bloody insensitivity and cheek to carry on using electricity for fun when all our area was supposed to be closed down.

The next minute we could see bollockings in the games room and all the lights went off in the building, typical Civil Servants.

[DAVIDW 1,681]

Strange about the Hancock name and will have to have a look at the earlier census'of 1851 or 1861 .

However there is a marriage of a William Hancock to possibly a Charlotte Spencer in Nottingham in 1866 . That is after your 1853 date so the Charlotte Hancock in 1911 is probably a different lady to the nurse in the 1850s.

Maybe the building belonged to the Hancocks and it was mother or sister to William Hancock ?

How does the name Wyville come about ?

[Bubblewrap 3,815]

There are four Hancocks listed in Glover's directory of 1844

Samual Machine maker Hyson Green

James Flour agent Leen-Wharf

John Lacemaker Victoria Street

Thomas Lacemaker Victoria Street

At this time there were two Victoria Streets & they are Not the preasent one that runs Bridlesmith Gate - Carlton Street built around 1865

[firbeck 859]

Davidw, it's interesting that the building came up for rent in 1921, this must be when Frank Broadhead started up the practice. I recall rooting around in the office archives for drawing number 1. This turned out to be details of a new main entrance for Nottingham Forest FC, all drawn out on silk paper as most were then, and dating from the early 20's. A mass of drawings dating from the 20's involved the redevelopment of large areas of Wollaton Park land following it's aquisition by the council in 1926, FB was responsible for designing some of the large houses along Wollaton Rd behind the park wall, I seem to recall some involvement with Parkside, Wollaton Vale and Adams Hill as well.

I looked up Wyvill(e) in Wiki and the name stems from an aristocratic Yorkshire family, perhaps they owned property or land in Nottingham, wanting to be next door neighbours to the Duke of Newcastle perhaps.

[SallyAnne 3]

I have just this evening discovered this nostalgia about 2 Castle Place. Vernon Royle was my father. He lived to a good age (95) and died on September 22nd 2011.

I did not realise he was thought of as eccentric! Perhaps he was.

I went to cover for Miss Stanton for two weeks when she was on holiday - afternoons only - in I think 1981. I stayed 3 years!

Miss Stanton I think sometimes thought I took advantage of my father's being the boss - yes, I probably did occasionally! She thought I was spoilt which I suppose I was.

She had had a very tough life really - she had worked hard since she was 15 and couldn't wait to retire which she eventually did, in her 70s. She very sadly died 6 months later of bowel cancer. My mother and I visited her before her illness and had tea with her. The house was very gloomy with plastic covering the hall carpet.

I also worked with Joyce Whitehorn, Mr Whitehorn's gloriously joyous wife. She and I hooted with laughter whenever she was there too ( two days a week I think) . And not forgetting the lovely Rita Holwell- she worked mornings though so I did not see her. I knew her from calling in on numerous occasions .However she and I keep in touch and I call to see her every Christmas , as my father did.

My father was a brilliant artist actually - he could draw someone he had only seen for a few seconds and capture them perfectly. But he could not draw my mother or me nor anyone close to him.

I hugely enjoyed working there - and reading your description of the office and entrance etc brought back many memories . Thank you .

[LizzieM 9,507]

Welcome to Nottstalgia SallyAnne. Hope you find other topics to interest you.

[Michael Booth 7,364]

Welcome to Nottstalgia, SallyAnne. I look forward to reading your posts and sharing your memories.

[YoungH 6]

OK, I'm biting. I went to Seely Church School. Why the bank of earth????