Cliff Ton

Nottm bus routes 1940s

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Re Bulwell bus routes, 44 was longer than the 43 going from Bulwell Hall Est ("swinger pub") to Colwick Crossings), think? the 42 ran as far as Catchems Corner (Northern Bridge)

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I have never heard of the Northern Bridge being called Catchems Corner. My sister lived on the Highbury Vale Estate from 1938 to 1955, and between those dates we travelled by Trolley bus from Mansfield Rd to Nottingham Rd, then transferred to the 43 for the rest of the way.

Going off at a tangent, In my neck of the woods just outside Stoke-on-Trent there is a Catchems Corner at the point where the modern A50 turns from the old Line of the Roman Road from Derby.

Who or what was Catchem? And why should he have a corner? Perhaps its a generic name for certain points of the map. Are there any more Catchems Corners anywhere else.?

Very problematical.

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There are a numbers of Catchem/s Corners in the country, including Wolverhampton and Stoke. I think the name derives from nicknames for tollgates on old turnpike roads. The toll fee was collected by a tollgate keeper for most people wagons etc passing through - they would 'catch'em' for the toll.

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"I'm not sure it is a problem, it was probably named after the pub nearby"

The pubs still there, it's the bridge that's gone!!..................... slywink

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It wasn't the bridge that was called that, I just put that in as a pointer as to where catchems corner was/is , it was of course never an official street name, my assumption is it was used by the locals to describe a place where you could "catch em" (the em being a shortened "them" and meaning trains or trams}

We can only rely on what we're told or read as being correct when it comes to history of that era? I was told that the Midland Railway built Vernon Road with it's original "southern end" joining Church St as an "Old Basford Bypass" so road traffic (what there was in those days) need not go through the "village" (and thereby cross the railway twice) on it's way to Bulwell originally via said Church St (or Nottingham Rd) then Lincoln St crossing the railway for the 2nd time and continuing up Southwark Street then left onto Bulwell Lane and so joining Highbury Rd. Where those 2 meet now there is a corner, but prior to the coming of The Great Northern and the building of The Station Hotel there, now officially renamed Catchems Corner (even though the windows were/are still engraved "Station Hotel") have no idea of the road layout,

Have edited this post after seeing the pub still called CC, thought it had reverted to it's original name, that road to the left of the pub in the photo is Bulwell Lane, if you go 180 degrees on that photo you can see where the GNR crossed the road where the "new brick buildings are in the distance, "Northern Court" is on the site of the road access to the station

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I suspect "Catchem's Corner" is nothing more than an old euphemism for the local pub - i.e. the place where weak-minded men and their pay-packets were detained !

I seem to remember my mum saying that if her paternal grandfather, who by all accounts was a somewhat downtrodden little man, was asked where his wife was, would reply "She's down catchem's corner" - simply meaning at the pub. (I think this was somewhere on Colwick Road). She apparently had a fiery temper (possibly Irish I think). For example, if great granddad gave the slightest indication that the meal looked unappetising, she would pick up the plate, no messing about, and sling the contents straight into the fire !

If I am right, the present name for the pub on Vernon Road may be quite a modern innovation, picking up on the old nick-name.

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Where those 2 meet now there is a corner, but prior to the coming of The Great Northern and the building of The Station Hotel there, now officially renamed Catchems Corner (even though the windows were/are still engraved "Station Hotel") have no idea of the road layout,

Can't find a map which goes back that far, but this is close. 1870s, and although the railway is there, not much else is. Note the lack of any "Corner" and any pub.

vernon.jpg

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I'm with notty ash (#53) on this one.

 

It would seem that the name Catchem Corner originated from the days of the turnpikes and toll gates and it was only natural that pubs should spring up to slake the thirst of the weary travellers at such points of mandatory stops:

 

 

There are a numbers of Catchem/s Corners in the country, including locally in Wolverhampton and Balsall Common. These were nicknames usually for tollgates on the turnpike roads where a fee had to be paid by travellers to the gatekeeper who would 'catch'em'.This Catchems Corner was the popular name of the tollgate at the junction of the Lichfield Road with Park Lane and Rocky Lane at Aston Cross. The Lichfield Road was part of a route dating from medieval times which linked Bristol and Worcester to Lichfield and the North-East and was known as 'one of the four great roads of England'. The Lichfield Turnpike was created in 1807. The next tollgate was at Cuckoo Lane only a mile further north. The road was disturnpiked in 1862 when responsibility for its upkeep fell to the Warwickshire County authorities.

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Yes, could well be be just a nickname, but as the map shows no pub in the 1870's so would the locals have used that name in later days? as mentioned I only relate what I'm told, my dad was born in 1916 at 510 Vernon Rd and he said it was always known as cacthems, would like to see the next section showing Bulwell Lane going "south", maybe as far back to Southwark St and the crossings? (thanks)

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would like to see the next section showing Bulwell Lane going "south", maybe as far back to Southwark St and the crossings? (thanks)

Wider scale so not quite as clear......

vernon3.jpg

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A couple more and then I must be gone.

..............turnpiked in the 18th century and Catchems Corner relates to a
toll house that caught people........UK History.

There is also mention of a Catchem's on the turnpike going through Bingham in the olden days.


IMHO, these tollgates did not have to be on a road junction as evidenced in some threads that I have read on this subject. Read on one thread of a carrier being fined and his load confiscated because he drove his horse and cart across a farmers land to evade a toll gate further down on the A50.

It is more than likely that the Vernon Road pub was originally on a toll gate site and then down through the ages, especially with the abolition of the turnpikes, there was artistic licence and the pub sign became a man running for the train.

Who knows....I don't. hellothere

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Thank you ciff ton, as you say not so clear, but you can still see Bulwell Lane was the only road, also that the angle of the road/railway crossing was far different to what's there today, "aimed at" Lincoln Street (and indeed named thus) whereas today and for many years more of a right angle with David Lane being the main road and the crossing called such.

As regards a turnpike who knows, though no sign of any toll house and the original name of the pub was the station hotel (more than likely owned by The GNR?) think the name change more of a gimmick, along side the likes of the slug and lettuce etc

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Catchems what???

Here is another reason for a location being called Catchems Corner.............

The confluence of Cromwell Lane, Hob Lane and Red Lane was a point on the old cattle droving road from the Welsh hills to London. The cattle had usually been on the hoof for some days before they reached the fields near the end of Windmill Lane. Here they were rested in order to feed and gain in weight and strength for the remainder of the journey. After three or four days in which to recover the cattle often became very lively and frisky and their drovers had great difficulty in catching them. That particular resting place thus became known as ‘Catchems Corner’. (The West Midlands Village Book - 1989)

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I seem to have posted two comments in the wrong topic (Bulwell Common Station) - repeated here for completeness

Having kicked off the idea of it being a turnpike term, I am now worried if ever there was a turnpike along there. When Byron was buried at Hucknall, his funeral route from Nottingham allegedly went up the Mansfield turnpike and through Papplewick, because there was no good road from Bulwell to Hucknall. This list is all I could find - and it seems unlikely to me that any of these passes through Bulwell? http://www.sabre-roa...shire_Turnpikes

This map

http://www.turnpikes...e turnpikes.jpg

suggests that the road from Bulwell to Basford was off the turnpike system altogether.

This gives a complete list of tollhouses in the county - Radford and Bobbers Mill are the only ones even close by, as far as i can see.

http://www.turnpikes...inghamshire.htm

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The pub on Vernon road is shown on a 1913 map, but unnamed.

In a list of business addresses on the back of the map, it states. Carlton john v Station hotel.

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So the pub was built sometime between 1876 and 1913? 1875 being the year The GNR opened the Colwick to Pinxton route and 1876 when the first passenger trains ran on it, would hardly have had a pub called The Station Hotel before there was a station? When the "bypass" was built still not sure, ditto the alteration of the original route (from the Nottingham Rd junction to the top of church st bridge) to it's present alignment where it meets Western Blvd/Valley Rd. I do know Church St bridge was built post 1876 (the girders of it state "Made in Bradford" with that date) so maybe the bypass dates from then? An interesting fact is from 1848 when The Midland Nottingham to Mansfield line opened till that bridge was built (28 years) there must have been a level crossing at the side of St Leo's, never seen a photo or drawing of such, nor seen on any map so far, also seems to indicate the route to Basford/Bulwell/Nuthall etc then busier than say the Nuthall Rd where travellers had to still use a level crossing till the 1930's? makes me wonder if there were any bridges built at all when the line first opened? if not at a rough guess 8 level crossings from the Derby line to Bulwell Market?

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Not sure if this answers any questions or just poses a few more. 1880s - the GN is obviously there, but not Vernon Road.

basford-2.jpg

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A very interesting map. When was the gas works built? Could that have been at the same time as Vernon Road?

I am pretty sure that Basford Crossings was always officially Lincoln Street Crossing to MR LMS & BR. Not David Lane. The original road priority is seen on the map.

The Great Northern connection to Babbington/Cinderhill collieries is shown but not the Midland one!

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Well that map does indeed show the Church St crossing, along with the Nottingham Rd and Lincoln Street ones, yes the latter crossing was "aimed" at that street, unlike today's arrangement which is more 90 degrees towards David Lane, No idea why the MR line to the pits (now part of the tramp line to former pit site) is not shown, but the branch to Bennerley Junction is, The gas works far as I know were there before the Vernon Rd new route from Nottm Rd junction to Valley Rd, I recall a gasometer in the land that was later a Bob Churchill,s car breakers later still a John Fox VW sales depot (not to be confused with "Smithy's" that was on the site of the original Vernon Rd) seems to me the MR skirted around the gas works property originally, then later either they or Nottingham Corporation diverted the road maybe when the need for gas lessened due to widespread electricity and gas works land became available for sale? (guessing to be honest)

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A Robinson designed ex Creat Central O4 actually !

  • Upvote 1

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Any idea when the number 32 route to Strelley started?

 

I lived on Denewood Crescent opposite Fircroft avenue in the 60's so I had the choice of  the 16, 16A and 32 for my commute to and from town.

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Probably the mid 50s, as the number 32 was used for a short lived service to The General Hospital, in the late 1940s.

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