Avro Vulcan prototype


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Hi Rob

I was at Syerston and saw that Vulcan crash at the tender age of 4 - and I am sure it was 1957 not 58. My father was taking me to my first ever air display so it was likely a September one usually organized in memory of the Battle of Britain. I was standing on the grass at the front of the crowd with my father when the Vulcan came in low and fast from our left. Then we could suddenly see what looked like hundreds of sheets of paper coming off the back of the Vulcan. Someone shouted - its coming down and then everyone threw themselves to the ground and my dad threw himself over me to give me some protection. Luckily we were some way off the crash site. Later we walked down the runway and the only remains of the Vulcan we could see was the nose-cone which was lying upside down on the runway facing the "wrong way" back up the runway. I understand the reason for the crash was the complete disintegration of the leading edge. With the aircraft flying so low it had no chance as it could not get sufficient lift under its big delta wing without its leading edge.

Sad, very sad and I didnt know about the Air Cadets being killed. I think pilots did push aircaft too hard in the 1950's and zooming in from a great height then flying down a runway at great speed was a favourite trick. In this case the Vulcan clearly couldnt take it. I do recall it was very very low.

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"..there's often an unannounced Spitfire fly around over our place here in Ilkeston during the summertime, always a splendid sight to see.." A Spitfire that quite often turns up locally - usually mid

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It was Battle of Britain Day, September 1958, we had gone to Cottesmore instead that year and fortunately missed the crash.

If you can face looking at it, there is an infamous picture of the Vulcan breaking up on:-

www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread/186611/pg1, it's just how you described it.

For a look at happier times, taken at Cottesmore, BoB day, 19/9/59, the year after, Vulcan, Valiant, Victor, the big three.

cot1.jpg

cot2.jpg

cot3.jpg

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"...On the 20th September 1958, at 13.55, Vulcan VX770 crashed at RAF Syerston while taking part in their Battle of Britain display. The following has been taken from the file in the National Archives at Kew. For anyone interested the file is BT 233/403..."

My suggestion that Air Cadets were the ground victims was wrong...evidently the Portakabin occupants were ground controllers.

Full description, with exceedingly dramatic pictures, on link below...

http://www.john-dillon.co.uk/V-Force/vx770.html

Edit: Just noticed there are links to some more detailed reports on other major V Bomber accidents at the bottom of the above linked page...RP.

Cheers

Robt P.

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Looking at those pics made my heart flutter, I'm glad I wasn't there, I've seen a couple of fatal crashes at airshows later on in life and believe me it wasn't pleasant, especially the RNHF Firefly when I was one of the first on the scene, I don't want to think about it.

About 20 odd years ago, XH558 used to take part in the Fighter Meet displays at North Weald, until the local residents got it banned.

We used to skive off work and watch the participants arrive on a Friday lunchtime. In those days you could get right up to the runway threshold, armed with a full camera full of film, we watched the Vulcan come in and he misjudged it and hit the rough ground in front of the runway, sitting a few feet from a bouncing Vulcan was no joke, but he controlled it and deployed the brake chute, that was the last landing they ever made there. As for my film, the perforations ripped and it didn't feed through, cameras have a habit of letting you down at the wrong moment don't they.

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I have some film of S/L Paul Millikin's notorious XH558 take off at North Weald when the tarmac was ripped from the end of the runway, and a nearby farmer took legal action to compensate him for the loss of several cows - that died of fright!

Cheers

Robt P.

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Firbeck - it seems your hyperlink leads to a dead page - any chance of checking this as I would like to know some more about this crash? Cheers

Rob - thanks for the detail about the crash, I had no idea how really dreadful it was. The report states that from the start of the breakup until crash was just 6 seconds. I guess I witnessed the first three or so seeing the leading edge and one wing edge breaking up and seeing the nose lift - after that I was on the ground with everyone else. The description explains why I saw the nose-cone facing back up the runway as in its final moments the Vulcan turned a cartwheel and must have come down on its back. Its chilling to realize how close I was to such a serious accident and a miracle that more people were not killed or injured. Yes planes have crashed at air displays a number of times but this was one big aircaft moving at speed and in close proximity to a very large crowd of people. The debris trail on the runway proves it did fly down it and we were not standing very far away as it came in.

Very scary but it didnt stop my dad taking me back to more air displays in the 50's and 60's.

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"...Very scary but it didnt stop my dad taking me back to more air displays in the 50's and 60's..."

To your Dad's credit in ensuring that, visiting more shows after seeing the accident, was less likely to leave a long term adverse effect on you. Potentially a very 'scarring' event for one so young...

I recall, as a 7/8 year old, witnessing a seemingly innocuous low-speed car collision on Broxtowe Lane, which culminated in one the vehicles rapidly catching fire and both occupants being burnt to death - as helpless onlookers could only stand back as the car soon became an unapproachable fire ball.

For some years thereafter, I was extremely fearful of using any form of transport - especially the motor car.

Cheers

Robt P.

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Notts Lad

Google, UK, Vulcan crash Syerston, and it's the first site, entitled Mishaps Big Birds, there's just the one picture, but there are other references.

It's interesting that despite the large number of airshows every year, no member of the viewing public in the UK has been killed as the result of an accident since the Sea Vixen prototype broke up at Farnborough in the early 50's. One of our neighbours from Plantation Road was there that day, he would never talk about it, all I know is that one of the engines went over his head and into the crowd.

In the old days you did get some seriously worrying acts of 'Derring Do' at airshows, I'm not suggesting that anything untoward was performed with this Vulcan, but it was an early model and a constantly used test bed, it seemed to be flying out of Hucknall just about everyday when I was a kid, so it had probably been highly stressed above and beyond the call of duty prior to the accident.

I recall being at a show at Cottesmore when I was young and the weather was appalling. This didn't stop the famous Black Arrows 111 Squadron flying Hunters, carrying out their formation routine at low level over the crowd during an intense thunderstorm, I remember cowering behind the hangar doors, the passage of time may have altered my perception of the events, but I do recall my old man being more than a little concerned.

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Ian's Post 208/Page 11:

Noticed that the petition to the PM to save XH558 has seemingly ground to halt with only 11,000 signatories.

As they were hoping for 200,000+ it doesn't look too promising!

Cheers

Robt P.

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Right you grab Bingham by the throat and I'll do Winsford ,then we get the others to do their relative areas .................................!!

http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/vulcan-XH558/

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Yes come on firbeck, with all the influential people you know the powers that be should be fighting each other off to get a piece of the action. VULCAN TO THE SKIES---FIRBECK TO THE RESCUE

Rog

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  • 3 weeks later...

Another nail in the XH558 coffin:

Chief Pilot Dave Thomas has resigned from the project, after a 44 year association with the Vulcan.

He flew 22 of the 26 assignments during 2008.

http://www.vulcantothesky.org/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=3958

Dear All,

I am saddened to inform you that with effect from today I am no longer your Chief Pilot as I have resigned from the project. This ends my 44 year association with 558. I wish to thank you all for your unstinting support & trust you placed in me & the commitment you to have given to the project. I am well aware that without you, all her fans & supporters, the project would have failed long ago.

David

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=qHHStin7q8A

Cheers

Robt P.

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  • 1 month later...

According to a press release, if the Vulcan to the skies trust can't raise £400.000 in the next month they are going to declare the project/company bankrupt,

Some American company's or individuals have shown an interest in buying the whole thing but if that happens it will all be shipped to the United States, so it looks like the only flight it will be making will be to the USA, the staff at Vulcan to the skies (14) have been put on a months notice

Rog

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What a bloody shame

Why can't the government do something to aid our national heritage instead of bailing out the fat cat bankers, (Now my spell checker has packed up)

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Come on every body out there in Nottstalgia land sign this petition (If you haven't already done so) If like me you have more than one Email address use that too!!!!! Please

http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/vulcan-XH558/

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About 10 years ago I went to the Jet Heritage Airshow at Cranfield, it was great, plenty of 1950's a/c flying about, formations of Hunters, Vampires, Venoms, Meteors, Canberras, whatever, so where are they now.

Well, they aren't about anymore, not many anyway, why, well they cost too much to operate.

A few years ago, the worlds only airworthy Sea Vixen was touted around the airshow circuit, wonderful beast, biggest, fastest heritage jet flying, but where is it now, it's still airworthy but no-one can afford to book it at airshows, it's rarely seen, but presumably the general public haven't a clue what a Sea Vixen is anyway, so who cares, impressive, but so what, only us select band of enthusiasts presumably get excited at the prospect of seeing it.

The Vulcan is a different story, everyone thinks they remember it, but do they really, it's a big old beast, the Cold War Warrior and Falklands War hero, a museum piece, it's flying days were pulled when the original RAF operators realised how much it would cost to keep it going.

Thats the problem isn't it, the cost.

TVOC were living in cloud cuckoo land when they started this project, they paid their 'directors' large sums of money to run the project, they incredibly managed to obtain a lottery funding, yet always kept their cards close to their chests.

It's one thing operating a Hawker Hunter, it's bloody expensive, but a Vulcan, beyond belief.

I think that they felt that a rich benefactor, ie Mr Branson, would come along and everything would be Hunky Dory. I'm afraid that RB has enough problems running his own empire, I don't think he should donate his own personal fortune to such a hobby, would you in his position.

Imagine, the cost in keeping the Vulcan airborn, the airframe requirements, let alone engine problems. It's been trouble to keep it up in the air this season anyway, silly things, but aren't they going to escalate into more serious matters.

OK, you will say, I'd sooner go and see the Vulcan fly rather than my tax payers money spent on one eyed Somali single mother illegal immigrants, fair enough, but we are in such a financial crisis, that how can anyone justify the government spending money to keep an airshow legend alive.

I really, personally want this project to succeed, but we have to get it all into perspective, no amount of signatures to 10 Downing Street will keep it going, and why should they consider it, it wouldn't matter which blurry party was in power, it ain't going to be considered in the scheme of things is it.

Sorry to be so negative, but with all my own problems, I tend to live in the real world, if the government felt happy enough to chuck in mega bucks per month to keep this thing flying, while as a 58 year old British Citizen not qualified for benefits because I've been self employed, how would you feel, they ain't interested in me, so why should I think that they should care about a bloody old jet bomber, much as I love it, but lets not forget, God works in wondrous ways, anything could happen, them damn Rooskies were Anti-Christs after all.

No, I'm an atheist, just blurbing, thats all.

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No, I'm an atheist, just blurbing, thats all.

More like a Realist Firbeck..

Keep on posting.....that's wot I say.

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Do these people really want to keep the Vulcan in the air? The show they put on last Tuesday was an engine startup plus maybe a trundle down the runway at Bruntingthorpe, OK, admittance by ticket only, OK. Tickets cost £20 each, OK. but only on sale the day before the "show" Monday when not many folk can get there and only advertised at the last minute, I found out about it on Thursday, two days after the event,

Rog

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Just been on Lincs FM news (11.00) that members and employees of the Vulcan to the skies trust might get the remaining £500.000 needed to keep 558 alive in the UK. They are visiting all 15 preserved Vulcans in the UK to raise awareness to their plight, For those interested they will be at Newark air museum at about lunchtime today (Sunday 22nd Feb) and then on to Waddington for a photo call in front of 607 at approx 15.00hrs with, possibly some of the aircrew.

Rog

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  • 2 weeks later...

Just heard (via my mum) that the remaining funds have been raised and it's all systems go for the coming season!!!!!!!!

!bravo! !bravo! !bravo! !bravo! !bravo! !bravo!

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You beat me to it Beefsteak, I heard it on the local station today Lincs FM complete with an interview with Martin Withers of Black Buck fame (Vulcan 607) good news at the moment and in this economic climate they done well, however they will need £1.5 m next year so lets hope it keeps flying and attracts as much publicity as possible.

What's next Ian? "Concord to the skies" that would get world wide publicity and be able to pay for itself????? just a thought

Rog, (looking forward to this flying season)

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