Arthur-Robin
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Posts posted by Arthur-Robin
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I haven't yet been able to get the 2 certficates (mother's (underwood) and aunt's (hucknall)) yet, but my mother said on the phone that she has an old certificate which only says she was born at (sounded like) [Laurel?] House, Underwood.
Apparrently the name Petrucci was only a guess of hers when she was searching in UK though. So with no name there is only trying to get the address (as i was advised here) in the hopes someone may know/remember something.
(She also said she found an old scarf of grandads which has a hair with the root if it is of any use for genetic test [though it may be degraded or contaminated]. Interestingly she said she had a list from UK of things possible for genetic paternity test, which was much better than the pitiful couple of things the places here only say. (As always, UK has better services than small NZ.))
(Unfortunately though she also had bad news that she found out in the last week/s that she may have lung cancer.)
Also spoke to the Red Cross restoring families person here in NZ [the UK wouldn't do it] who took the details and is going to get back to me in few weeks, but it doesn't sound promising as it still sounds like they insist have to do it their only one way of have to have a name and not being able to view any lists/records that i need to help work out what the name is (as i do/did with other history topics/discoveries). (This is a problem i have a lot that orthodox always only think/willing to do things their one set way.)
Anyway if Laurel House is of any help/use let me know.
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Just update on all the new info so far:
Thanks to a reply from uncle John just now, in combination with all the other previous info (from people here, and opther) i now know:
uncle Eric eldest born Grimsby
uncle John born 1942 Hucknail/Hucknall (Basford, Nott)
aunt Margaret born 1943 Hucknail/Hucknall (Basford, Nott)
Italy surrenders 1943
family lived in Hucknail/Hucknall "about 3yrs" [total? / after Eric/Marg born?].
end of WW2 1945
affair with Italian pow c May/Jun/Jul 1946 [somewhere in Basford reg district]there were Italian & German pows in Underwood around about the time.
my mother Jennifer born apr 1947 Underwood (Basford, Nott)
census 1951
family came to NZ in 1954.
census due to be released 2052.So i can't be sure whether the affair was in Hucknall/Hucknail or Underwood (or if somewhere else between those places), only that was certainly in Basford district and most likely Underwood or 2nd/likely Hucknail/Hucknall (or least likely somewhere between them).
If/when i am able I will have to order both my aunty Margaret's and my mother's certificates to find out the 2 addresses (since that means i don't know for sure which town the alledged affair was in in 46). But my mothers cert would only give the address 9-10 months later and my aunt Margaret's only gives the address few years earlier.
[Yes sorry, annswabey, i did know you said i'd have to pay, what i had meant was just that a few contacts had suggested freebmd site but i found that that site isn't really all free as i had had impression from its name.]
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It looks like there may have been at least 2 or more main originals for Robin Hood at different times and places who were fused together.
From my "where was RH" counties list i have tentatively narrowed down to 3 or 4 main counties: Yorks/Barnsdale, Notts/Sherwood & Derbyshire, Northamptonshire.
Some of the main candidates are
- the "hart" that K Richard chased from Sherwood to Barnsdale (Notts & Yorks)?
- Robert of Kyme. http://www.beautytruegood.co.uk/robin2.htm
- Hobbehod (early 1200s) (Yorks) (LVD Owen, JC Holt)
- Roger Godberd (Notts). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Godberd
- Robert Hood of Wakefield/Newtown/Bichill/Alverthorpe (early-mid 1300s) (Yorks) (J Hunter, JS Lockwood-Allen). http://theblueboarinnrobinhooddiscussions.yuku.com/topic/1002/Jayne-Susannah-LockwoodAllens-Discovery#.VbiCjbVGQWE
http://www.ladydespensersscribery.com/2014/03/29/guest-post-by-tony-wait-clement-glen-robin-hood-identified/
- Robert Dore of Wadsley (1380s) (Yorks) (M Keen, R Lynley, G Kirkby). http://robinhood-loxley.weebly.com
One Robin Hood seems to have opperated in Barnsdale W Yorks. "Robin Hood's barn" seemingly may be Barnsdale. At least one candidate may have opperated in or have connection with both Yorks & Notts.
One early-late RH source mentons red cliffs of Sherwood. Does anyone have any info on any red cliffs and/or just cliffs in Sherwood/Notts?
Some possible descendants of Robin Hood that we have so far are:
- Billy Hardcastle mentioned by people on page 1 of this thread.
- Dr John Russell Pope-de-Locksley.
- Jayne Susanna Lockwood-Allen might be descended from both Allen-a-Dale and Robert Hood of Wakefield/Newton/Bichill/Locewode?
- I found there is a Hood in my family tree about 7-8 generations ago, but Hood is a common surname so may not be related to RH.-
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My uncle John says/claims he doesn't have his birth certificate, and that he was born at a different place to my mother. (I rang my mother yesterday and my step father said she has an infection and couldn't talk. I looked up freebmd.org but turns out it is not really free at all but still have to pay to get cetrificate from registry district office.) So it looks like it is impossible to find out what address in Basford registration district the affair was at. Even if i get my mothers certificate it only gives address at time of birth not where they were 9-10 months ago. All i can say was my uncle John was born couple/few years before my mother in Basford distric, and my mother was born at Underwood in Basford district, and my aunt Margaret was born somewhere in Basford district after my mother. (Also, the Red Cross finding relatives / repatriation person replied that they wanted to see/talk me, but i am not sure if they will have anything much from previous replies from other Red Cross offices.) So i think i will call it quits as it takes too much time and effort and money etc while i have other serious troubles and things i need and want to do. (It is not impoosible just made to hard by everyone/world.) But i am cutting off from all my mothers real/supposed side of family for being so opposed/unhelpful.
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People who don't care and/or are judgmental.
(Esp people who have/had it all (partner/married, etc) judging or not caring about people who are worse-off (single/alone, etc).)----
(it is true that governments have too many rules/laws against us, but there are some things in libertarianism that peeve me.)
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Water fluoridation.
Sugar and salt in otherwise good food (ingredients lists in order of amount).
Sprayed food (even "organics" spray apparently).
Smart meters being subtly forced on us.
Phone books removed from phone boxes (and sounds like phone boxes been removed in UK too [because of vandals?]).
Raised reflector studs in middle & side of roads.
Day light savings.
Noisy neighbours (stereos, souped up cars, etc).
Can't get normal woolen longjohns here in NZ (can in UK) only merino or poly....
Too baggy legs trousers (new / in shops).
People making noise in libraries.
Windows 7/8 (too many distractions, etc).
Churches all having same block of singing followed by block of sermon format.
Scammers and spammers.
(Thats just a few minor/major off top of my head.)
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To be fair re ignorance of English some of us haven't had a very good upbringing/education etc."Devotees of grammatical studies have not been distinguished for any very remarkable felicities of expression." ~ Bronson Alcott.
"Correct English is the slang of prigs who write history and essays." ~ George Eliot, Middlemarch, 1872.
"I don't give a damn for a man that can only spell a word one way." ~ Mark Twain."When I split an infinitive, god damn it, I split it so it stays split." ~Raymond Chandler
"Correct spelling, indeed, is one of the arts that are far more esteemed by schoolma'ams than by practical men, neck-deep in the heat and agony of the world." ~ Henry Louis Mencken, The American Language.
"Grammar is the logic of speech, even as logic is the grammar of reason." ~Richard C. Trench
"This is the sort of bloody nonsense up with which I will not put."
~ Attributed to Winston Churchill, rejecting the rule against ending a sentence with a preposition, c.1948, may instead have been said by an anonymous official (*)"Nostalgia is like a grammar lesson: you find the present tense, but the past perfect!" ~Owens Lee Pomeroy
(All in good humour/balance/fairness no offense meant.) -
Thank you for that Annswabey.
My uncle Eric says there is no address on his birth certificate, but i didn't remember to ask him whether it is full birth certificate or short one. He was born in Grimsby and says they shifted alot so another difficulty. I will have to ask my mother before i buy certificate as she may have her own herself anyway, but is difficult since i was abit negative last time i spoke on phone with her.
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Thank you mick2me and PeverilPeril.
Sorry, i don't mind humour, i just misunderstood because i thought it was related to academic critics mocking me which i have had elsewhere.
Sorry, i am often commented on on forums for not posting very easy to read/understand posts (i have aspergers).
Yes there are at least 2 or 3 Loxleys. One Loxley near Sheffield in Hallamshire/W Yorkshire, one Loxley in Warwickshire and or in Staffordshire. There is also a Locewode/Lockwood in Newton/Bichill/Wakefield area, and -ley can mean "wood".
Each have RobinHood claimants/candidates: Robert Fitzodo of Loxley Staffs/Warwicks. (late 1100s-early 1200s), Robert Hood of Wakefield/Newton (early 1300s, proposed by Hunter and by Jayne Susanna Lockwood-Allen).
We can't leave him alone, there are too many critics/disputes and unknowns.
It would be good to find out about the historical RH. Finding out about real historical persons is interesting and important. Just like the finds of things in the bible have been really good.
The Nottingham link looks pretty strong, so there is no worry. And there is no reason why RH can't have been in more than one county (like Notts and Yorks).
I don't think Robin Hood can just be a myth. See the timeline of sources i posted, there seems a lot of pro evidence there. But he may possibly partially be a myth in that he may be a conflation of more than one person or many people, so "RH's" adventures may not all be from one person (or two persons) but from many over upto 200 years (1160s to 1380s).
One of my possible RH candidates is the "hart" that King Richard chased from Sherwood to Barnsdale (like he &/or his men are "hart/deer" in one or two RH stories/chapters/adventures).
here is a partial list of some RH sites for better/easier to read info than mine:http://robin-hood-was-here.blogspot.co.uk/
http://www.robindesbois-lespectacle.fr/
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2749136/Was-Robin-Hood-Yorkshire-Outlaw-ties-county-Nottinghamshire-claims-expert.html
http://theblueboarinnrobinhooddiscussions.yuku.com/topic/1002/Jayne-Susannah-LockwoodAllens-Discovery?page=2#.U8XJp5CBpgU
Robin Hood group on facebook
http://www.beautytruegood.co.uk/robin1.htm
http://www.beautytruegood.co.uk/robin2.htm
http://www.beautytruegood.co.uk/robin3.htm
http://robinhoodlegend.com/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robin_Hood
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robin_Hood%27s_Grave
[robin hood trail]
robinhood-loxley.weebly.com/
www.robinhoodloxley.net/
robinhode.webs.com/
issuu.com/grahm/docs/robinhood9
www.robinhoodlegend.com/robert-dore-wadsley/
therealrobinhood.blogspot.com myweb.ecomplanet.com/kirk6479/mycustompage0014.htm
midgleywebpages.com/loxley.html
robinhood.ltd.uk
http://www.robinhood.info/society/junioroutlaws.html
http://sherwoodforest.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/NSDC-Robin-Hood-Trail.pdf
www.boldoutlaw.com
http://www.imaginingstaffordshire.org.uk/mystery/mys5.htm
http://midgleywebpages.com/loxley.html
http://robinhood.wq2rx.com/candidates
http://folktalesyorkshire.multiply.com/(Sorry i can't go through them all on slow dialup to write some details of what each is about.
The main RH candidates include Robert Fitzodo / Robert de Kyme / Robehod, Robert Hood of Wakefield/Newton, Robert Dore of Wadsley.) I would be interested in any other sites people can add.
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Thankyou Iandawson. I don't know if Lisle/Eric Edwards husband of my grandmother Rosalba grew potatoes, but i know my uncle Eric is a bit of a gardener, so he might have.
Thank you Davidw for the Italian sites & conference/academic, & book info! I had previously tried a couple of searches but hadn't found much (i guess i didn't search very well).
Thankyou enigma1st, bubblewrap, and poohbear for the pow camp info. I will add them to the list (of other 11 Notts pow camps which i posted on the first page).
Sorry for any offense Annswabey. I have quite a rough/stressful situation and condition which may be part of reason why i get abit negative sometimes.
I have asked my uncle Eric about address and he said "I am sorry Sean but I do not have the information you are seeking." I don't know whether he is telling the truth or still being not wanting to help / not wanting me to find out. If he's telling the truth then that must mean no address on his birth certificate. (He had previously said he remembered after/when my mother was born.) -
When was Robin Hood?
The range of dates from scholars suggested-candidates is (late) 11th cent / 1110/1165 - Henry 8th, or (the main candidates) from 1170s - late 1300s/early 1400s.
RH must have been before Henry the 8th....
The dates range from traditional dates of RH is (b) 1160 - (d) 1347/1374.
It is said the long bow was not commonly used before 1333.
RH must have become an outlaw before Piers Plowman of 1377. (Though it is suggested by Graham Kirkby that RH could be contemp with writing Piers Plowman and died after.) [Maybe also before Richard Rolle at Hampole 1349?]
The king in RH is traditionally either Henry/Harry [2/3/4], Richard [1/2], John [Lackland / of France/Gaunt?], or Edward [1/2/3 / Black Prince?]. (The queen Catherine might narrow down or might be unreliable.)
If sir Richard at Lee was going to Holyland then the crusades were between 1095-1272? (Though this is uncertain as shown by Graham Kirkby.)
If RH was connected with Ranulf earl of Chester (as seemingly maybe in Piers Plowman) then RH must be under either of the 2 / 3 Ranulfs earls of Chester (1120-1129, 1129-1153, 1181-1232). (Though it is suggested by Graham Kirkby that a later historical RH place was connected with the earlier Ranulf.)A partial/unexhaustive timeline of RH sources/refs:
clues date to (lat)11thC (RH legend)?
{pipe roll 1186 (Fitzodo)
rolls of viduis 1186 (Roberti(i) filii Odonis)
7 entries piperolls 1191(-7)/1194 (Robert de Huda)
liber niger sicarrii 1190s (Robertus filius Odonis)
Yorks pipe roll 1196 (Rob fil Odo)
exchequer roll 1198 (RH)
royal court rolls 1198-1199 (Robert de Hood)
royal court rolls/rot.cur.reg. 1199 (Rob deHodelme)
feet of fine 1199-1216 (Robert son of Odo)} ***
calendar roll, pardon 1210 (Robert de Kyme) ***
Major Oak c 800 yrs old **
{calendar patent-rolls H3 1216 (Robert Fitzodo);
deed rel to mill of Wolseley, early H3 (Robert fil Odonis);} *
{pipe roll of Sheriff of Nott 1225 (RH);
curia regis roll 1225 (Robertus Hod)
York Assizes 1226 (Robert Hod);
cal pat rolls 1227 (pardon Roberto de Kime/Kyma);
pipe-rolls 1228-30-31/1225-26-27 (Robert Hood/Hobbehod);
9 Yorks pipe rolls 1226-34 (RH/Hh);} ***
calendar patent rolls 1242 (Robert son of Eudo) **
court rec 1245 (Robert de Lockesly); **
Halle 'Jeu de Robin et Marion' c1280/1283/1285;
Statute of Winchester 1285 (arms/sword/bow&arrows/knife);
subsidy roll 1292 (hostel of Robin Hod);
{undated 13thC lib niger (Robert Fitzodo/Fitzothoh);
Muskham chronicle 13thC (unnamed outlaw)} ***
setting of ear ballads13th/14th; *
household accounts 1323/1324 (Robyn Hod(jadis)); ***
statute winchester 1331 (Roberdsmen) *
correspondence 1324-1346 (RH's Bay); *
Fordun scotchron 1377/1370/1341 (Robertus Hode);
Langland Piers Plowman 1356/bef1360/1377 (rhymes RH); ***
royal writ 1363 (archery, K Edward, sheriff);
"there were no friars in Engl before the 14 cent"?
May Day games ear 15th at latest (RH);
"RH was here" Lincoln cathedral 1410
Wytoun/Wynton Orygynale Chron 1400/c1420 (RH&LJ);
Linc Cath Ms c1420 (1st RH song);
monk bretton deed 1422 (rh's stone*)
1st RH game 1426
complaint/petition to parliament 1439 (RH);
W Bower revised Scotichronicon c1440/15th (RH,&LJ);
earliest copy ballad RH&tM aft1450;
a monk, margin of Polychronicon c1460 (RH)
Witham chronicl 1460 (RH)
RH&tSofN c1472;
complaint to Star Chamber 1492 (RH);
[Rolle/deWode] A lytell Geste of RH c1475/1490/15th/1507;
earliest copies ballads 15th/1stdecadear16th;
RH games late 15th&16th
Alex Barclay c1500 (RH or MM)
earliest ballad RH&tP c1503
Chapman & Millar's edition Geste 1508
Doebock's version geste 1510
printed RH ballads ear 16th
John Mair/Major HGE/HMB 1521 (RH)
Leland c1540 (Ro. Hood)
Grafton chronicle 1542/1569 (RH)
Copeland's geste RH 1560
reg Scot 1584 (RH/RGf)
Sloane ms 16thc [RH]
1 of Shakespeare's earliest plays, lat16th (RH)
A Munday 1598/end16th/1601 (RobEofH)
play 1600 (gilbert hood)
R Cecil 1605 (RHs)
Camden 1607 (RH's tomb)
Dodsworth 1620 (RH/RL)
drayton polyolbion 1622 (RH)
M Parker 'A True Tale of RH' 1632
Jonson 1641
broadsheet 17thC (RH)
broadside ballad 17thC (A-a-D)
Harleian ms c1650/17th cent (Robert filii Odonis)
Percy folio ballads 17thCent (RH,GofG)
Thom Gale 1635-1702 (RH, EofH)
1st RH placename in Sherwood 1700
ballads from 18thC (Robin, tinker, tanner, ranger)
RH&LJ 18thC
grave of prioress found 1706
Dugdale 1730 (Robertus fil Odonius/Fitotes)
Peck collection RH ballads 1737 (RW)
Stukeley 1746 (RH/RFo)
Hargrove 1792 (RH)
J Hunter 1783-1861/19th (RH/RH)?
J Ritson 1795/1832 (RH)
W Scott Ivanhoe 1819
editors note in Ritson's RH 1820
AThierry 1825 [RH]
Planch 'Rambly with RH' 1864
Gutch & Hinklies 1866 (RH)
H Pyle 1883 (RH)
(Tennyson)/Sullivan 1892 (RH&MM)
Encyc Brit 1911 (RW)
LVD Owen 1936 (RH/Hh)
Errol Flynn 1938 (RH)
J Hunter 1952 (RH)?
Platts 'Real RH' 1980;
JC Holt 1982/1984/1989 (RH)
{R Carpenter, Robin of Sherwood 1984;
Somerset Herald 1987 (Robert of Hood)
RH Prince of Thieves 1991;
FJ Child 1997? (RH);
B Green 2001;
J Luxford 2009 (RH).}-
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I'm not sure if one/some of the comments are mocking/joking? I know that orthodox academics are over-/arch-critical of everything. I am also often mis-understood. I'm not in Notts or even UK but on opposite side of world so i don't know alot of local trivia (I do check everything i can). Thanks for the interesting (if not mock/joke).
People are always complaining about taxes and beneficiaries. Yet do they ever raise a squeak about corporate shareholders who brag that they "don't work (hard) but [their] money works for [them]"? At least taxes are supposed to go to helping everyone, whereas linecharges only go into shareholders pockets (not maintenance as claimed/supposed/assumed).
Some Robin Hood sources say his partner was Chlorinda rather than Marian. Maid Marian might be linked with the chapel of Mary Magdalene that Robin built in forest. (Compare Edwinstowe? Blidworth?)
There are a number of proposed graves of Robin Hood including at Kirkby/Pontefract, Kirklees, Crosby Ravensworth, [under a wardrobe in a pub in Notts?], Loxley (Staffs/Warwicks), etc.
I was thinking that there is a faint possibility that there might be someone or something under Major Oak (which dates to ca 1215 and could have been planted/sowed on/over/above someone/something buried under). (Though it doesn't sound like there was anything found under the other tree RH's Larder not too far away?)
But the RH grave / Kirklees at Kirkby/Pontefract theory seems pretty convincing.
Doctor Pope-de-Locksley claims to be a descendant of Robin Hood/Robert Fitzodo.
Holmfirth has some interesting possible connections.-
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Nevermind forget it, i quit, I am feeling very annoyed and hurt pride/ego, please excuse me if i write abit negatively.
I would rather pay someone to find an entry in electroal roll than for a cert. Is the "in order of addresses" by towns/areas/parishes or by streets? If by areas/parishes it wouldn't be that hard to find since couldn't have been that many people or Edwards in Underwood/Basford then.
As i said somethings i don't mind or are worth paying for and somethings like a stipid piece of paper or e-copy just/only for one stupid detail i do mind and aren't worth it.
I don't understand why 40s certs have address and other certs before and after don't.
I will try to ask my uncle and/or mother first, but my uncles are playing refusing to cooperate/help, and my mother (i was abit negative to last time on phone because she had) seemingly joined them in changing her mind and becoming opposed to finding out.
I have to make certain whether this is or isn't any lists of pows in Notts or not. Any lists would certainly help. Same with the other angles/sources/possibilities.
I can respect your research experince, though i still personally don't like the having to get certificates they always have in ancestry research. I aren't exactly not experienced researcher myself, though my experience is mostly with earlier not modern/recent.
Thankyou for the newspapers if i un-quit in future when pride less hurt.
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I did a search of the forum on Robin Hood and was surprised to find there are no major topics/threads on Robin Hood, though there are a few on him. So i thought i would post a thread/topic on Robin Hood, though i am not sure i will be able to follow/reply it very much (other things i really need/want to do soon if/when i can).
The idea is to see if we can find historical evidence of where/when/who RH was. People can also post links to RH sites.
Now i must say that i am neither pro nor anti Nottinghamshire's claim and/or any other claim like Yorkshire. I don't want to offend any Notts fans. Finding the truth is the purpose.
Also, it seems that there may perhaps have been more than one Robin Hood, so he may be of more than one time and place.
For this first post here is a first bit on where was Robin Hood?
(This is only an rough attempt to narrow down what counties/shires are most likely. The more/less asterisks the more/less likely. The list is nowhere near exhaustive/complete.)Counties/places that have connections with RH in tradition [and/or in scholarship] include:
- Skye: Bernisdale.
- Cumberland/Cumbria: Inglewood forest; Plumpton; Robert de Hood (1198); RH's Grave, Crosby Ravensworth; RH('s) Buttes; RH's Chair. *
- Westmorland: RH('s Wood); RH's Grave.
- Hexhamshire: RH Tree/Sycamore Gap (H's Wall).
- Redesdale: Robin of Redesdale.
- Yorkshire: (priory of St Mary at) Hampole / Barnsdale/Beornsval/BernardsHill (Richard Rolle); [church of St Mary Magdalene at Campsall (Gam(e)well?)?]; shirley Wood (Barnsdale); K Richard chased a "hart" from Sherwood to Barnsdale; church at Skelbrooke; RH's Close, Whitby; RH's Bay; Wakefield; Locewode; Doncaster; Kirklees; Kirkby/Pontefract; gold(e)sborough/goldburgh; Sowerby; St Mary's at York; Robert Hod (York, 1226); Saylis / (Blue Bell Inn in) Wentbridge; Loxley; Greenwode; Calder(dale); Plumpton; (cobbler/shoemaker of) Bradford; Greno Wood; William Tempest of Studley 1444/1409/1382; Studley Royal Park, Fountains Abbey; (lord Robert Dore of) Wadsley "Robert Hode" 1382; Robert (of) Wetherby (1226-1230); (Robert de) Kyme?; k Edward 3 parliament 15 times York; RH's Well; LJ's Well; Bishop's Tree; York "yew tree"; Guisborough/Gisburne/Gisbvrgh; RH Tower (York) / RH's Tower (Richmond Castle); Huntingdon (ridale/ryedale); Broun Robyn de Holm of Holderness 1292; [Heudnesse/Holderness & Ridale/Ryedale (Matt Paris)?]; Robin of Holderness 1469; RH's Park; RH's Well (& Wood); RH's Stone; RH's Bower & Moss; RH Hill & House; RH's Butts; RH's Howl/hole/hollow; Master Hobbe Hyrste, Robin Goodfellow’s brother 1489. ***
- Sowerbyshire: Richard Hood Of Sowerby 1274 (son John Hood 1296-7).
[- Lancashire: (slew a knight of) Lancaster; (passe of) Lancasshyre; ["duke of lancaster"?]; Wyresdale; Plumpton; (Guy of) Gisburn; Robyn Hode (during king's progress thru Lancashire) / Robert Hood of Wakefield summond to join the Earl of Lancaster's army?; richard de Leghs/Leghe in Lancashire; Townley (suggested Richard at Lee candidate)?; RH's Cross; RH's House.] *
- Hallamshire (Yorks): little Haggas croft, Loxley chase.
- Lincolnshire: Lincoln green; Robert de Kyme of Lindsey; Eagle Barnsdale; Odo the Crossbowman; Robert Hod (Lincoln assize roll, 1206); "RH was here" Lincoln cathedral 1410. *
-- Nottinghamshire: (sheriff of) Nottingham/shire; Nottingham Castle wall(s); Major Oak / Edwinstowe, Sherwood forest; K Richard chased a "hart" from Sherwood to Barnsdale; Brunnesdale/brounesdale/brynsdale/brinsdale (Basford); Blidworth; Trent; Fountain Dale; Friar Tuck's well; Papplewick; RH's Pot / RH Hill (Oxton); Newark (Friar Tuck?); St Swithins church Wellow (yews); dungeon of K John's Palace (Kings Clipstone); Hodsock??; RH's Well (Nottingham / nw of Nottingham / near Newstead); RH's Cave; RH's Grave (Holbeck nth of Mansfield); RH Hill ~ RH Pit; RH's Hills; RH's Larder/The Shambles, Birklands; "RH's Stream"?; Huntingdon Street; [Miller of Mansfield?] ***
-- Derbyshire: sheriff of Notts & Derby; deer; Hathersage ("LJ's grave"); LJ's Well; Erewash (Verysdale); Dale / Dale Abbey / Derbyshire Dales; Hodthorpe; RH's Well; RH's Cave; RH's Croft; RH Cross; [Hob Hurst's house;] Hood's Tor (Matlock)?; misdoers in Derbyshire "like Robyn Hode" 1439. ***
- Cheshire: earl of Chester; RH Field; (uprising 1393,) archers 1397.
- Staffordshire: Loxley (hall, Uttoxeter); Robertus fil Odonis; Lud's Church; Tutbury castle; Watling Str; [Robert Stafford "Friar Tuck"?]; [tanner of Tamworth?]; Huntingdon; Roger Marshall of Wednesbury "RH" 1498. **
- Warwickshire: Loxley; Robertus filius Odonis; Watling Str; [Guy of Warwick?]
[- Leicestershire: Swannington; LJ's stone.]
- Rutland (admin by Notts & Northants): Barnsdale; RH's Cave. **
- Northamp(ton)shire: Plumpton; Wakefield; Robert de Hood 1191/1194; Barnwell; bromswold/brun(e)swald Forest; Salcey; Willow Brook (salix, ~ Saylis); Watling Str; [Northampton Castle; Rockingham Castle;] 'RH & LJ' (2 stones); Robert Hood 1354. ***
- Huntingdonshire: (earl of) Huntingdon; Barnsdale.
- Cambridgeshire: (bishop of) Ely; Robert Hod (at Isle of Ely).
- Bedfordshire: Thurleigh [aet thaere Lea]/Leigh ?; Knotting; [Ludlow?]
- Buckinghamshire: Watling Str; Salcey Forest.
- Hertfordshire: Watling Str; Sherrards Woods; Barnet(Vale)/(New)Barnet. *
- Herefordshire: (bishop of) Hereford; RH's Butts.
- Worcester: Robert Hod c1230 / 1234.
- Gloucestershire: Robin's Wood Hill; Nottingham Hill.
- Shropshire: Fletcher's Ludlow church; Hodnet; RH's Butts.
- Wales: Rybyn Hod / Hodsville (Swansea).
- Devon: Robert Hod 1237; [(John Littlestone of) Barnstaple].
- Somerset: Robert Odde 1234; Will Scarlet 1199; RH's Butts.
- Dorset: Hod Hill.
- Wiltshire: RH's Ball, Salisbury (Saylis?).
- Berkshire: William Robehod 1272; Robehod/Rabunhod 1262/1261; RH 1230/40; Hodicote/Hodcott; RH's arbour/bower.
- Hampshire: John Rabunhod 1272; Robert Robehod 1294.
- Surrey: RH's walk, Richmond Park (Henry 8th).
- Sussex: Gilbert Robehod 1286; Gilbert Robynhod 1296; Robert Robynhoud 1332; Robert Robynhoud 1381; Robert Stafford "Frere Tuk" (1417-29, chaplain from Lindfield Sussex).
- London: councilor Robert Hod/Hoode 1294/1297/1318, Hostel Robin Hod/RH Inn 1292, Katherine Robynhod 1325.
- Essex: Alexander Robehod 1272.
- Suffolk: Robertus Robehod of Walsham le Willows 1283.
- Kent: Hoodening; William of Kensham / Willikin of the Weald.
- France: Robin des Bois.
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I don't think the address will be on the certificate, it doesn't have any address on my certificate or my grandfathers. My mother may not have been born at their home address. I am not buying a certificate unless the address is guaranteed to be on it. Have you any examples/evidences from the same period of addresses on birth certificates? There are other ways to find address other than alledged birth certificate like phone book, electoral roll, etc. As in other subjects people seem to get set into strict ways of doing things. (Eg the isp/ip were set on the net problem being because not upgrade until i told them i'd tried windows 8. Arthurians said i looked whre no one else looked. "Have to get a certificate".)
I am going to advertise in Notts/Underwood/basford papers/radio, can anyone tell me what the local/shire papers of those places/areas are please?
How do you know i won't be able to work out the right name from a list (of which there can't be that many Italians matching all the time/place/status/age). The fact is any list would help however supposedly-little.
I meant phone book/electoral for my grandparents address not the Italian's. The rolls & phone books are in names order so easy to find Edwards. (If they had phone then.)
Sorry for the delay i was totally distracted by another Notts subject which i am posting next after this. But it looks like everyone has become anti/negative/sceptical/unhelpful/offended anyway (i always seem to clash with people in subjects/topics). (Maybe its the fluoridated water.) -
you know, i gave away all my discoveries on "(King) Arthur", Atlantis, Joseph, etc for free* and they force me to have to pay to view Old newspapers etc. I wish i had of been able to publish my discoveries in such a way that they had to pay (since they refuse to even acknowledge/credit if not pay me for all my hard work and discoveries). Though i had to publish them becaue otherwise they would be still under their covering-up/silence treatment.
Somethings i don't mind paying for, but some esp old things they are just profiteering.
Though of course this is all my grandmothers and seeming-probable real-grandfathers fault. (Though uk shouldn't have been so lax/loose with its pows.)(* though they claim the dsicoveries are not true despite all the strong quality and quantity evidences.)
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p.s. a few more possibilities:
Alot of the (Italian) pows worked on farms, and basford is rural district? so the farmers families might know something or have records of workers?
I think it said in reference source that Underwood has alot of pubs? The Italian(s) may have gone to a pub...?
For the address: does anyone know if Notts/UK/telecom has old telephone books/directories like they did here in Wellington NZ 20 years ago when i was looking for my real father?
Or old electoral rolls?
What are the news archives that ****** mentioned earlier? Maybe there is mention of Italian/pow in obituaries or other if can search online for words like Italian?
And as i said in last post, my grandparents were Brethren so they may have had brethren friends/pastor/elders in Underwood/Basford?
What if i pay someone local to checkout various things for me? (I can do bank transfers/deposits/direct-credits. Someone on here or not on here might need/appreciate a few pounds, and i would pay for any/all reasonible/necessary costs. I can also do international phone call if necessary.) (Asking locals, looking up local/shire/national paper/library archives/records/papers, etc.) -
Ok, thankyou for all your help (you and each of the others). But just my comments/thoughts/opinions/difficulties:
But i thought her certificate will only say Underwood or Basford not her street and number?
(I don't remember my paternal grandfather's certificate that i had to get for "registering as a uk citizen" saying any street and number only Hetton le Hole, Durham?)
The census can still help because if the Italian stayed he would have been in census, except he may not have stayed in Notts (where there was/is large Italian community). Likewise if he stayed he would probably have been naturalised after at least 3 years. But the census isn't due to release until 2052; i might need the name for naturalisation records.
Any list of pows in Notts would definitely help me work out what the name is (without necessarily contacting anyone re privacy/spam suspicions). For example my mother might recognise/remember if see/hear a name. I might be able to work out from names what name is likely by various other ways. There can not have been that many Italian pows in Underwood/Basford at the time (though there were 100,000 in UK).
He seemingly may have been held in one of those 11 camps in Notts, and near Underwood/Basford, though may/jun/jul 46 is months/year after war end in 45 and few years after Italian surrender.
Which of those camps i listed is nearest Underwood/Basford?
How are we supposed to find out when the officials withold access to historical documents because not have one name? Do i need a court order or private investigator?
My grandparents were Brethren so maybe they were in brethren church there and then?
The only way i can find him is either
- if i had a certain name. But the only name/s i have are very dubious (Petrucci or "Hughes"?)
- if someone knows/remembers something 1st or 2nd hand from my grandmothers name, the place, the time. They may be my "family", the Italian (if not dead yet) &/or his kin, or neighbours/friends/officials/clergy/etc.
- documents: any lists of Italian pows in Nottingham/shire (in uk, in Italy, in Red Cross repatriation records/lists or Geneva war archive) would certainly help.
- ancestry genetic test but they say alot is guess, and they don't do ancestry genetic tetsing here in NZ only paternity/police and health genetic testing. But that may only tell me if recent Italian blood or not, not what family name (though they claim to find "cousins"). No one will help me find what is best ancestry testing company to try. I don't trust 'family tree dna'/'national genographic' for some reason. I have a bad situation & condition (incl ocd) and not easily able to deal with being sent and sending back "kits".
- paternity genetic test: but i'd have to be able to go to court and get a court order to be allowed to exhume my commonly/legaly assumed grandfather, that is if the dna isn't degraded or contaminiated; or my uncles would have to change their mind and be willing to cooperate rather than pettily/meanly/puritanically refusing because "damaging/scandalous"/offensive that grandmother may have had an affair. That would only tell us which is real grandfather, not what family name.
(- wait until after we die and find out at judgement day (if i make the 1st and not 2nd resuurection).)
(- if God/angel tells me in a dream/vision.)
(- time travel.)
(- mind reading?)
They charge rip off fees for certificates, and i have no reliable postal address because of attached company share flats neighbours attached letter boxes and junk mail/weekly papers problems (they keep putting papers in despite the 3 legal signs, and an attached flat neighbour keeps stuffing papper right inside box so no room for proper mail, and the flats boxes numbers in reverse order to street numbers so posties keep putitng in wrong box, etc). -
Sorry just to clear seeming possible confusion:
My grandmother is the one that was married to Edwards and had alledged affair with Italian pow ca may/jun/jul 46, my mother is the alledged offspring of the affair.
I don't think i need my mothers/grandmothers certificate. My mother was born in Underwood Nottingham in 47, her brother John & sister Marg were born in Basford in 42 & 43 respectively, so the alledged affair in 46 was surely in Basford/Underwood Nottingham/shire. (My mothers cert wouldn't say where she was conceived, my grandmother wasn't necessarily married or had affair where she was born.)
Yes i think i remember "family" members saying (my grandmother? and) my commonly/legally assumed grandfather Edwards were involved in forces in middle east (not sure if as soldier or [brethren?] chaplaincy) and married in n.w. Egypt. I am not sure if Edwards was still in forces but the affair was ca may/jun/jul 46 [after war ended and few years after Italy surrendered]
Sorry, ok i wont name living only deceased, though the few named were already named in replies.
So we have narrowed it down to an Italian pow near Basford/Underwood Nottingham/shire ca may/jun/jul 46 (thankyou).Thankyou Davidw, i don't think anything is impossible (though unhelpful people make it almost impossible), but sometimes somethings are easier with others help. Someone might know something given my grandmothers name and time and location etc. Or else there must be either repatriation or naturalisation and census records/lists/docs, and if i had a list of names i might be able to work out from it. Unfortunately the closest census isn't due to be released until about 2052! I may have to hire a private investigator if i can afford it since i don't have legal rights to view docs/recs under privacy laws.
The faintly possible name was Petrucci or "Hughes" not Palucci, i think (but the names are very dubious).
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sorry i made a mistake, that should have been john s edwards not eric s edwards.
there seem to have been quite a few similar happenings in UK:
http://www.italiangenealogy.com/forum/italian-genealogy/2205
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Thank-you annswabey & davidw
Yes Jennifer M Edwards is my mother's maiden name (she was born early april 47, the affair was circa may/june/july 46). (Note the Guinevere is suggestive?)
The Eric S Edwards is my mothers brother / my uncle.
The Margaret is probably my mothers sister Margaret.
No, its not the first Arthur Edwards & Helen Poole, it is the 2nd [Rosalba Poole & Lisle/Eric Edwards] (i think they wer married in n.w. Egypt?).
Yes the birth cert would say her father is Lisle/Eric C Edwards, but my grandmother was married and had an "affair" and the official records would not say that. My uncle Eric remembers time when/after my mother born, so grandmother was already married.
I don't have my mothers certificate but on my certificate it says she was born in Underwood Nottingham. From your info that is otherwise = Basford.
I'm not sure if any of the above violates privacy rules from what annswabey said? My grandparents are dead, my mother and uncles are in NZ, and my mother has different married name.I am interested to try find a copy of the 'italian connection':
https://woods2012.wordpress.com/history/old-memories/the-italian-connection/
I also just found this other topic on pow camps in Notts
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Thankyou CliffTon & PoohBear,
Ok my grandmothers name was Rosalba Edwards nee Poole.
Time circa may/june/july 1946.
Place (Underwood?) Nottingham/Nottinghamshire (i think?)
The affair was with an Italian pow (from story/evidence).
(My mother mentioned a name like Petrucci or "Hughes" from memory but they are very doubtful.)
After the affair it is said that my commonly assumed grandfather brought the family to New Zealand to get away from the Italian pow. (Sometime after my mother was born.)
There seem to have been quite a few pow camps in Notts:
raf camp Langar
tollerton camp, tollerton
boughton camp, new ollerton
3 magdala Rd Nott
serlby Hall camp, blyth
carlton Hall, lindrick, worksop
wollaton Park Nott
norton camp, cuckney, mansfield
carburton camp Youngrough Breck, worksop
ledbury/gpc Herefs & Notts (german?)
nether headon, retford Notts
[langar Nott?] -
Hello, my name is Sean. I am in New Zealand and am searching for info (public or private message) on my seeming-probable/possible real maternal grandfather &/or family. There are evidences &/or story that my maternal grandmother had an affair with a ww2 Italian pow in (Underwood?) Notthingham/shire in circa May/June/July 1946 (and that my mother came from that). Unfortunately i don't have any name/s for the pow (except possibly a very-faintly possible dubious name). My mothers main sources (aunties [and her mother and father]) are all deceased now, and my uncles are not willing to help (being christians they consider it offensive/scandalous [as if all humans are not mixed good and bad]). We can not get a paternity test because the only sample from my mothers commonly/legally assumed father is hair without the roots. I don't know whether the Italian pow was repatriated or stayed in UK (but i had had the impression for some unknown reason that he stayed). (I have emailed the red cross to ask if they have repatriation lists.)
I am not sure if i am allowed to give my deceased grandmothers name (which is necessary for if anyone possibly knows anything), since in this forum's rules it says about strict privacy? If i am can you please say so and i will post in next reply post, or else i can give link to other forums posts i have posted that have her name.
Either any thing anyone might know about the story/affair, or else any suggestions as to how/what might be good for me to find out info/records may help alot (census? naturalisation records?). Obviously I am not in UK/Notts and it is not easy to search this from NZ. (I have been really wanting to shift to UK for ages but am still stuck here having been held up by situation/condition here, having to apply to "register as a uk citizen" since only mother not father born in uk, and by disability/income/accomodation in uk requirments. My mother Jennifer was born in Underwood, and she went back to the UK to live for awhile about 10 years ago, but about 5 years ago she came back to NZ (after my sister's suicide and) after she had some health toubles and had no close family in uk.)
End of the world weekend
in Owt' Abaaht Nowt !
Posted
I've seen a few christian forum threads/topics / posts about this september being maybe something "big" going to happen. I think we probably have at least a few years/decades/centuries left yet though (though my own end could be any second/hour/day/week/month with these heart pains etc). Can anyone add past/present/future ones to my list?:
1917 bolshevik / 1918 ww1
1940s water fluoridation.
1944 Bretton Woods plot
1945 end of WW2
1948 Israel
1950 date for b.p. dating system.
1957 Treaty of Rome
1962 "general world decline (Great Pyramid calendar)".
1966 LaVey;
1967/8
1980s Rogernomics
1984 Orwell
1986 Halley's comet
1990 human genome project begun
1991 Antarctica
1992 Maastricht
1996 Clementine 2 / [star wars?]
1997 Hale-Bopp comet (Heavens Gate "cult")
1999 smartmeters planned (NZ)
2000/2001? human genome mapped (Clinton speech).
2000 y2k;
2000/2002 alignement 5 planets
2001 great pyramid calendar stops
2003 Clementine 2
2003 "Nibiru".
2004 transit of venus?
2004 impact world tour (NZ)
2007/2008 freeview tv began (NZ)
"2008 is 60 yrs since 1948", B Hinn's "new yr".
[2008 moon & jup & ven?]
2009 Benedict xvi encyclical "super-UN"
2011se58/pyr-shape obj./elenin?
2011 "end of world",
2012 transit of venus?
2012/2013 Mayan # world age ends/starts
2013/2014 freeview tv (analogue switch off).
2014 2lunar eclips
2014&2015 bloodmoons
2014/2015smartmeters
2015 2lunareclipses
2015? Francis "new global authority"/"fix world"
2015 conjunction Venus & Jupiter
2015(-2065) jubilee.
{2015 sept 10 things/15 days/266th day/500 days, Hadron collider experiment.}
2017/8 smartmeters/digitalisation/transhumanism?
2020s [Thiele's?] end times/last days
2020s/2029 comet/meteor Apophis due to encounter earth.
2030 agenda [agenda 21 on steroids?]
2040 4 planets conjunction.
2045 initiative
2052 UK census released
2061 Halleys comet
(2015-)2065 jubilee
before 2074 Yellowstone due any minute.
2117/2125 transit Venus
[2467 jup & sat in aquarius]
{Age of Aquarius starts (and/or Age of Pisces ends) in either 1447/1994/2012/2062/2150/2595/2600/2680/2691/2700/2720/2817/3621.}
2854: 9 planets synod.
c3400 "Nibiru".
http://www.christianityboard.com/topic/21882-critique-this-prophecy-please/