What is a 'Just ' War?

[DJ360 6,733]

I'm starting this in the hope that the 'Poppy' thread can stay respectful and not descend into argument.

 

That said, I'm also hoping we can discuss when a war is 'Just' without getting into a 'left-right' ding dong.

 

Mods.. I won't be offended if you decide to 'pull' this thread.

 

So... when are we justified in sending our armed forces into action against another nation, or another political group? 

 

Col

[plantfit 7,629]

I think the term "Just War" is used to sort of legalise the intervention in other country's problems,that doesn't mean I agree or for that matter have any say in it,what we see as "being the right way" for us doesn't necessarily mean it is, that is just our opinion,there are a lot of things happening in this country that others don't agree with and because of that they have decided to wage war against us and it is their opinion that it is a "Just War",I don't know,I suppose it is one of those questions that has been asked and will continue to be asked until the end of time

 

Rog

[loppylugs 8,429]

FWIW. It has always seemed to me that the majority of folks on either side don't really want a war.  They are dragged into it by the fanaticism of leaders of either side. Eg. hitler.  And the co-operation of the media of the day in demonizing the other side.  Then the financial institutions get busy financing both sides and the best of the youth shed their blood.

[FLY2 10,109]

Exactly. As in the Falklands war, the French, Belgians, Czechs and numerous others were supplying the Argies. 

Marvellous isn't it as the EU was supposed to be loyal to us. 

In my mind, it was a Just War, as the inhabitants wanted to remain under British control.

 

[NewBasfordlad 3,599]

A 'Just War' flipping heck that's a deep question which I am not sure anyone can answer to everyone else's satisfaction.

 

Two prime examples of a just war to me are 1, WW11 we were in imminent danger of being invaded and our country would have ceased to exist as we know it. I know we went in to help others but it is for sure we were in the firing line too. 2, The Falklands Conflict, British sovereign territory had been invaded and people who wanted to remain at Britain's side killed and or imprisoned. I was on 24 hour standby for that one as we were one of the few regiments with air portable armour, fortunately the Marines & Para's had no need of us.

[DJ360 6,733]

I should start by saying that I'm not entirely sure what a 'Just' War is either.. but I dug this out earlier and it gives a few clues:

https://www.mtholyoke.edu/~jasingle/justwar.html

 

It seems to me that most of the wars I've heard of since the dawn of history were wars of conquest.  It seems to have been pretty normal behaviour to either conquer your neighbour, or to scare them into offering 'tribute' to avoid getting battered. Kings and Emperors were mostly judged by their record in war and conquest.  Launching such a war is not Just IMHO.  Defending youself probably is.

 

We Brits were engaged in lots of  'colonial' wars during the 18th and especially the 19thC.  Our leaders sought to justify them with talk of 'pacifiying' or 'civilising' the 'natives'.  Whilst I'm sure the Livingstones of this world sincerely believed that, the real reason for subduing the peoples in our empire was to grab what we could.   Not very Just at all.

 

WW1 was I suppose the last gasp of Autocratic Monarchys in Europe as they made a last stand against the march of democracy and universal suffrage.  Clearly a bit more complex than that and Britain was only drawn in via a complex set of treaties. I doubt anyone's position was really Just.

 

WWII.  We were certainly justified in fighting the Nazis, and as I recall we were obliged to enter the War when Adolf invaded Poland, because we had a treaty with the Poles.  It is interesting though to consider what we would have happened if we hadn't had that treaty.

Once we were threatened with invasion by the Nazis, and they started bombing us.. our cause became Just eitherway.

 

I believe we were right to chase the Argentines out of the Falklands because history shows that nobody, including the Spanish, before Argentina gained its independence, made any claim to the Falklands.  We did.  However, I wasn't over happy with some aspects of the way the war was fought and the domestic political capital made out of it.

 

I don't believe our interventions in the middle East have been Just, but since WW2 all of the major powers have engaged in such activities either directly, or by proxy, to protect their interests in oil etc.

 

Also, 'Militant' Colonialism has been replaced by Economic colonialism, especially in the way the USA has treated the rest of the world as its shopping basket.  Expect China to do the same.  It's only fair after all..... 

 

Finally.  Whether or not I am personally in favour of any particular military adventure by the British Govt. does not affect my support and admiration for our military.  Our armed forces sign up to do whatever the Govt. of the day asks them to do so they have no choice.  If I protest against a military intervention, that doesn't mean I'm 'disrespecting' our Military.

 

Col

 

[DJ360 6,733]

9 hours ago, loppylugs said:

FWIW. It has always seemed to me that the majority of folks on either side don't really want a war.  They are dragged into it by the fanaticism of leaders of either side. Eg. hitler.  And the co-operation of the media of the day in demonizing the other side.  Then the financial institutions get busy financing both sides and the best of the youth shed their blood.

 

Loppy, I couldn't agree more:

 

Robert Zimmerman summed it up nicely

 

Col