Anything Political

[oldphil 331]

6 hours ago, DJ360 said:

Johnson remains a blustering waffling fraud.  He's maintaining his track record very well.

 

In which case,  Starmer should have no problem exposing his weaknesses. Hopefully,  he will listen to his cabinet and yield to common sense.

There will be much horse trading in the coming months. On which point, OZ - now that China is banning beef imports from Australia (in retaliation for your government daring to suggest an inquiry into their behaviour), perhaps you could flog it to us? Especially now we are out of the EU?

 

[Oztalgian 3,299]

oldphil,

The Chinese are now saying that it is not in retaliation for our PM saying there should be an inquiry into the origin of Covid 19 it is because of discrepancies in certification labelling of cartons versus what is on waybills as to the cuts of meat in the cartons. The abattoirs have acknowledged isolated cases of incorrect labelling. The ban affects 20% of our beef imports to China.

The Chinese are also set to introduce an 80% tariff on our barley imports too, they claim it is because of "dumping"

Looks like a mass dummy spit by a totalitarian regime that continually produces substandard product and ships it all over the world.

I am sure we would be happy to ship you some beef or any other products you need, what do you suggest you send in return?

Our politicians need to grow some balls and ban future imports of any Chinese products that fail to meet our standards too, but I doubt it.

[DJ360 6,730]

Brew,

You may be relieved to hear that I'm not going to do a blow by blow response to your response to my views on Corbyn.  We won't agree anyway. You should also remember that I was not a fan.. more because of what he didn't say than what he did.

 

Just a couple of points.

 

-He is/was not  'as far left as it is possible to go'.. certainly in a absolute sense. He was on the far left of the Labour Party, which is a democratic party, not one concerned with revolution such as the Workers Revolutionary Party, Socialist Workers Party etc.

 

-It's a mistake to equate his personal views.. with those things which emerged from Labour Conference as Policy.  Putting it another way.. you know well that there are views held by elected members on the right which are very extreme, but which are not officially Conservative Party or Govt policy.. yet this doesn't seem to worry you as much.

 

I simply do not accept that Corbyn's spending plans were either 'outrageous', or 'uncosted'.  You just didn't like them. And Johnson's responses were pretty much, to put it crudely, just a 'p***ing contest.

On 5/13/2020 at 2:51 AM, Brew said:

The comparison with today's pandemic spending is totally different. One was a deliberate policy that would cripple the economy and today the government has no choice.

 

No. One was a different approach aimed at repairing the damage caused by largely unneccessary Austerity, compounded by the deliberate running down, hollowing out and asset stripping of our Public Services in an orgy of ideological AND financially self-interested looting by the Tories and their mates, which also added to the housing crisis, the North South Divide and the Wealth Gap.

 

The other, I agree is necessary spending and borrowing.. though if the NHS and other Public Services had not been in such a run down state, we may have seen fewer deaths and needed less borrowing. Possibly a little melodramatic... but someone in 'another place'. commented that the Govt. " 'protected ' the NHS, by introducing the most brutal Triage system in history."

 

On 5/13/2020 at 2:51 AM, Brew said:

The billions we are spending now will probably have a knock on effect that may prove to be a gift to the detractors and yah boo merchants further down the line.

 

If I read you correctly, you seem to mean that the resulting debt will create a stick with which the oposition can beat the Tories.  'Au Contraire Rodney'.. I'd be more inclined to expect the Conservatives to quietly slip out of power and dump that one on Labour.. before rapidly sweeping back in on yet another wave of Media spin/lies claiming that it was Labour who spent all the money.   They've been pulling versions of that one since Thatcher.  Why change now?

 

On 5/13/2020 at 2:51 AM, Brew said:

They have no power.  Does that preclude them from having an opinion or suggesting alternatives?

 

No.. on both counts.  They are offering opinions and suggesting alternatives.  However.. if they do too much of that they run the risk of people calling them negative and being unhelpful... a view you are on record of agreeing with here... 

[DJ360 6,730]

On 5/13/2020 at 8:24 AM, oldphil said:

In which case,  Starmer should have no problem exposing his weaknesses.

 

So far he is doing so pretty well IMHO.  However, until the Meedja start to see it and say it. nothing will change. There is no escaping the fact that the UK press/media is genetically programmed to support the Tories.

[Rob.L 1,090]

Judging by the coverage of PMQs, and today’s case of three Tory MPs retweeting a doctored video Of Keir Starmer from an extreme right wing site which resulted in them deleting tweets, being forced to apologise, and being admonished by the Chief Whip, the mainstream media appears to be slowly but inexorably turning away from Johnson, Cummings, and his Cabal.

[DJ360 6,730]

I didn't see that.. but I fervently hope you are right.  Thanks.

[DJ360 6,730]

Lots of pressure to  re-open the economy.

 

And meanwhile.... the central plank of Govt policy in this disaster is ... 'ensuring that the NHS in not overwhelmed'.. with of course the implicit implication that the responsibility for this lies with the great British public... not with the Govt.

 

Think about that... because there is an implicit assumption that cases will remain or even rise.. but that's OK, so long as somebody.. anybody. but the Govt.. can cope.  The whole thing is predicated on the NHS coping, rather than the Govt taking the right steps to reduce cases. They STILL can't get their testing or Test Track Trace working.

Of course the missing bit is that however well the NHS copes.. by definition it will be receiving the sickest people, and of those who make it to IC, 50% will not survive.

Join the dots people!!

[Brew 5,422]

3 hours ago, DJ360 said:

with of course the implicit implication that the responsibility for this lies with the great British public... not with the Govt.

 

Quite how you interpret whatever source you have read as being an  'implicit implication that the responsibility for this lies with the great British public' I'm not sure - care to elaborate? 

Personally I'd say there's a symbiotic relationship between NHS, Govt and public  and it's incumbent on each to play their part.

 

If as you say the central plank of the Govt is ensuring the NHS is not overwhelmed I'd suggest they have achieved just that.  Where front line staff critical of the level of support?  sure a few where but most weren't and just got on with their job.

Where mistakes made? yes, no argument but we seem to concentrate on those and criticise rather than praise the HUGE efforts such as the building the Nightingale hospitals in an unbelievably short time.

I predict the new facilities will see less than half their capacity put to use and fully expect to see criticism of 'knee jerk', 'overreaction' and 'waste of tax payers money' when it's all over.

 

3 hours ago, DJ360 said:

and of those who make it to IC, 50% will not survive.

 

As for the scary statistic that 50% will die in the ICU, a critical care doctor is on record saying:

 

“The truth is that quite a lot of these individuals [in critical care] are going to die anyway and there is a fear that we are just ventilating them for the sake of it, for the sake of doing something for them, even though it won’t be effective." - The Guardian 

 

The testing and tracing is not done by Govt so it seems somewhat silly to apportion blame on them. They commissioned  the scheme and those responsible for carrying out the order should be the focus if they have not performed as expected. You know as well as I that the reasons, if there are any failures, will be may and varied. These schemes are overseen by career civil servants, hardly the Govt fault

I've have not looked but I seriously doubt the failure will be as expensive as the much vaunted NHS computer scheme under Labour that was a spectacular screw-up and cost 12 BILLION pounds before it was scrapped.

 

The Govt, as many here and elsewhere, have said is in an almost impossible situation. There are no definitive answers. We could have curfews and total lockdowns that would please some and bring others out in the street protesting. We could have total lockdown and rationing that would  cripple the economy for generations.

 

What would you have them do that you know for certain will be more effective and do the least damage to the economy?

[DJ360 6,730]

21 hours ago, Brew said:

Quite how you interpret whatever source you have read as being an  'implicit implication that the responsibility for this lies with the great British public' I'm not sure - care to elaborate? 

 

No source.  I figured it out for myself.  It's obvious.  The Govt knew from early on that they had lost control of the situation and feared that the NHS might be overwhelmed.  They were right to have such fears.. but they also projected those fears onto the general population and made the rescue of the NHS a task for the population rather than themselves.  Remember the slogans?  Remember 'flattening the curve'?

 

21 hours ago, Brew said:

Personally I'd say there's a symbiotic relationship between NHS, Govt and public  and it's incumbent on each to play their part.

 

Personally I'd say there  ought to be.  I'd say Govt has failed in playing its part on testing, early action, effective lockdown, and historically maintaining the NHS. The population has played its part.. mostly.. but has not been properly policed.  The NHGS seems to have done exceptionally well considering.

21 hours ago, Brew said:

If as you say the central plank of the Govt is ensuring the NHS is not overwhelmed I'd suggest they have achieved just that.  Where front line staff critical of the level of support?  sure a few where but most weren't and just got on with their job.

 

I'm still struggling to articulate what I mean on this.  Let's put it this way.  There should never have been any prospect of the NHS being overwhelmed, because Govt should have acted sooner and much more decisively.  If you think back.. you actually know that the dangers were known for weeks.. yet Johnson et. al ,failed to act.  I acted. I took precautions.. Many others I know did the same..  but Johnson was still burbling on about shaking hands with Covid patients and then claimed.. like Trumnp.. that 'in two or three weeks.. we'll beat it'.

 

21 hours ago, Brew said:

HUGE efforts such as the building the Nightingale hospitals in an unbelievably short time.

 

Well clearly they weren't quite as huge as they seemed, because they were achieved.. unlike getting an effective Track and Trace system in place.  A cynic might think that the Nightingale Hospitals had an element of window dressing, whilst the test track and trace re

flects more truly on the competence of Govt. Did I mention that much of the testing has been sub contracted .. without competitive tendering.. to some company which just happens to have a senior Tory lobbying on its behalf?

21 hours ago, Brew said:

I predict the new facilities will see less than half their capacity put to use and fully expect to see criticism of 'knee jerk', 'overreaction' and 'waste of tax payers money' when it's all over.

 

Not from me.  Just. 'window dressing'..

 

21 hours ago, Brew said:

As for the scary statistic that 50% will die in the ICU, a critical care doctor is on record saying:

 

“The truth is that quite a lot of these individuals [in critical care] are going to die anyway and there is a fear that we are just ventilating them for the sake of it, for the sake of doing something for them, even though it won’t be effective." - The Guardian 

 

Not sure what point you are making here. If people need critical care, they are 'cases'.  If Govt. had it right.. they might not be.

 

21 hours ago, Brew said:

The testing and tracing is not done by Govt so it seems somewhat silly to apportion blame on them. They commissioned  the scheme and those responsible for carrying out the order should be the focus if they have not performed as expected. You know as well as I that the reasons, if there are any failures, will be may and varied. These schemes are overseen by career civil servants, hardly the Govt fault

 

Who was it that said 'The Buck Stops Here' ?  Clearly not Johnson.. or your good self.  It IS Govt's responsibility to ensure testing is working.  It is simply wrong to blame others.

 

21 hours ago, Brew said:

I've have not looked but I seriously doubt the failure will be as expensive as the much vaunted NHS computer scheme under Labour that was a spectacular screw-up and cost 12 BILLION pounds before it was scrapped.

 

 

This is classic 'Whataboutery' and whether you are right or wrong is totally irrelevant to the present crisis. Also.. as far as I know.. nobody died.. unlike the present cl********k

 

21 hours ago, Brew said:

The Govt, as many here and elsewhere, have said is in an almost impossible situation. There are no definitive answers. We could have curfews and total lockdowns that would please some and bring others out in the street protesting. We could have total lockdown and rationing that would  cripple the economy for generations.

 

The economy would have sustained less damage if Govt. had acted according to the information available at the outset and according to the very loud warnings of the WHO.  It is entirely possaible we could have crushed the epidemic much earlier. But, because of Govt. dithering, incompetence and clear politicking.. we have a very slowly diminishing death rate, adding hundreds to the total daily.  It's hardly a triumph is it?  

[Brew 5,422]

3 hours ago, DJ360 said:

It's obvious.  The Govt knew from early on that they had lost control of the situation

 

It’s far from obvious and it’s only your opinion/interpretation that the Govt lost control. They did not ‘project those fears’ onto the public, they gave them the facts, plain and simple.

The Civil Contingencies Act 2004; The Pandemic Influenza Response Plan and Strategic Plan 2014 clearly demonstrate  Governments of both flavours made plans to meet a potential national health crisis.

The speed and scale of the infections were beyond any reasonable predictions to the point where the plans were inadequate. If there is fault in the predictions and planning it belongs in both camps.

I admit mistakes have been made but as we have mentioned several times we can only see them in hindsight.

 

3 hours ago, DJ360 said:

The population has played its part.. mostly.. but has not been properly policed.

 

We have seen some clowns failing to obey the rules but short of a draconian North Korea type regime that was always going to happen. In the grand scheme of things though, the numbers were relatively small.

 

3 hours ago, DJ360 said:

I acted. I took precautions.. Many others I know did the same

 

You acted and I salute you for your foresight, however you were in a minority, most of us did not go to the same extremes (I doubt there are many that go so far even now).

 

3 hours ago, DJ360 said:

A cynic might think that the Nightingale Hospitals had an element of window dressing

 

That’s rather unkind Col. The speed at which suitable premises were found, supplies and equipment sourced plus the logistics required to bring it all together was by any standard impressive. A lot of people put a lot of effort in to them and should be recognised for a job well done.

Happily some them were not needed as the anticipated demand for ICU departments never arose - a tribute to the NHS managing the situation even with ten years of austerity.

Sadly the criticism I predicted of the whole enterprise has already begun.

 

The problems with the track and trace app is more to do with technical limitations of handsets and the Android operating system than anything else. You demand faster responses and then complain that the tendering process was not followed - you can’t have it both ways!

3 hours ago, DJ360 said:

Not sure what point you are making here.

 

The point was that the bald statement, "half of all ICU patients will die", needed clarification. It’s not a failing of the hospitals or an uncaring Govt.

 

3 hours ago, DJ360 said:

It IS Govt's responsibility to ensure testing is working.  It is simply wrong to blame others.

 

 

The cabinet don’t do the testing, they instruct Whitehall to get it done and when it’s not someone has to fall on their sword. Ultimately the relevant ministers will have to answer if things go pear shape. You and I know no matter who is in government politics will rule and some bugger, any bugger but those at the top will get the blame.

 

3 hours ago, DJ360 said:

This is classic 'Whataboutery'

 

True it is ‘whataboutery’ but demonstrates that even with the best of intentions mistakes are made. It took nine years and a lot of wasted money. It was money which could have gone to recruiting staff and improving facilities. Money that was needed when Browns budget made the smallest NHS funding increase in twenty years.

I didn’t say anyone died but had the money been better spent who knows how many more could have been better served or saved.

 

3 hours ago, DJ360 said:

The economy would have sustained less damage if Govt. had acted according to the information available at the outset

 

You hope the economy would have suffered less damage but you don’t know for certain.

It is possible they could have reduced the effect but it is far from probable and by no means certain.

It’s not a triumph, no one says it is. It’s a beleaguered government doing it’s damndest, (I’m not getting at you here) but for some it will never be enough

 

[DJ360 6,730]

On 5/20/2020 at 4:39 AM, Brew said:

It’s far from obvious and it’s only your opinion/interpretation that the Govt lost control. They did not ‘project those fears’ onto the public, they gave them the facts, plain and simple.

 

No.  They ignored the known facts for months and failed to act despite all evidence from China, the WHO, etc.

 

On 5/20/2020 at 4:39 AM, Brew said:

The speed and scale of the infections were beyond any reasonable predictions to the point where the plans were inadequate. If there is fault in the predictions and planning it belongs in both camps.

 

No. Absolutely not.  The high communicability of this virus was known from at the very latest early March.  After an initial inexplicable attempt to supress info.. Chna went Global and was screamng info from the rooftops, as also was the WHO.

On 5/20/2020 at 4:39 AM, Brew said:

You acted and I salute you for your foresight, however you were in a minority, most of us did not go to the same extremes (I doubt there are many that go so far even now).

 

Well thanks for the recognition, but AFAIAC, I did not go to 'extremes'.  I sought to isolate myself from others and strangers. I observed social distancng from early on and I used more than usual.. but not 'extreme' hygeine measures.  I still am.  What I adopted as 'common sense', was very, very similar to what Govt. recomended for over 70s when they finally got around to acting.

  My chances of acquiring this bug may well be small.. but since I have a high statistical chance of not surviving it.. I'm being very careful.  After all.. I only need to catch it once.....

 

I don't mean to be critical of the 'Nightingale' builders and planners etc.. but surely you can see that the very fact they were proposed and built was an admission that it had lost control?

 

On 5/20/2020 at 4:39 AM, Brew said:

The problems with the track and trace app is more to do with technical limitations of handsets and the Android operating system than anything else. 

 

I don't know.  What I do know is that to lift the lockdown before Track and Trace is properly in place, by whatever means.. is yet another huge mistake by a Govt which listens to the Science, but only acts on the bits which suit it.

 

On 5/20/2020 at 4:39 AM, Brew said:

You demand faster responses and then complain that the tendering process was not followed - you can’t have it both ways!

 

Separate issue.  Seems that tory Grandees are getting their snouts in the trough.. as usual...  And today I'm rweadng rthat that well known paragon of efficiency and integrity, SERCO. is also in the running for a nice little earner.

 

On 5/20/2020 at 4:39 AM, Brew said:

The point was that the bald statement, "half of all ICU patients will die", needed clarification. It’s not a failing of the hospitals or an uncaring Govt.

 

I did clarify it.  I made it clear that the number of deaths was directly correllated to the number of cases and that IMHO the number of cases is down to Govt. policy.  It's not the fault of the NHS, but it IS the fault of an incompetent Govt.

 

On 5/20/2020 at 4:39 AM, Brew said:

The cabinet don’t do the testing, they instruct Whitehall to get it done and when it’s not someone has to fall on their sword. Ultimately the relevant ministers will have to answer if things go pear shape. You and I know no matter who is in government politics will rule and some bugger, any bugger but those at the top will get the blame.

 

I understand you point, but you must recognise that it is GOVT MINISTERS who daily claim to be 'ramping up' testing.  It's bad enough that they dish out this work like sweeties to their mates.. but for them to then try to blame others when they cock it up is indefensible.

 

On 5/20/2020 at 4:39 AM, Brew said:

It’s not a triumph, no one says it is. It’s a beleaguered government doing it’s damndest, (I’m not getting at you here) but for some it will never be enough

 

No.  It's an incompetent Govt... managing a Health Crisis and Pandemic as if it were a Political spat.  See my next post.

[DJ360 6,730]

Has nobody else noticed?

 

Intriguing to me, is the way that the dregs of the Tory Party which comprise Johnson's cabinet, have been consistently and nauseatingly 'polite' at the daily propag.. err 'Press Conference'. They are, to a man, including Patel.. unflinchingly polite, even to the most lowly member of the (screened) public.. and the rather less compliant 'press'. (That is if you are happy that Johnson.. via Cummings has excluded some long standing press people from even asking questions...)

They have clearly been heavily briefed to be as non-confrontational as possible . Sadly they also appear to have been briefed to admit nothing and to lie prodigiously.  I'm not just saying this because I have no time for Tory politicians in general and this lot in particular.  I'm saying it because it is so noticeable.  It's as if all of them have been programmed to respond exactly the same way.

 

It amounts to.  'Be polite.. thank your  questioner for their question...  Don't bite back.. just waffle.  Whatever you do, don't lose your rag..  If the question is awkward.. just waffle.. if you need help with this.. watch Priti.. or Dominic Raab.. they are really good at it

Such a sustained exercise in 'stonewalling' and misinformation is almost admirable..  except it is reprehensible.

 

Good old Grant (Multiple Personalities) Schapps did start to lose it this afternoon when heavily questioned over the totally indefensible actions of Cummings in travelling hundreds of miles in defiance of lockdown Rules which he most likely was central in creating... but Good Ole Grant had the Trump Card.. (Unfortunate parallel that..) in that he could just declare 'Press Conference over'.. and scurry back into his hole.

 

I wonder if he passed our PM on the way..  Where IS Boris?

[Oztalgian 3,299]

I am enjoying the discussions between DJ360 and Brew well done boys, so much to ponder.

 

I know its that Oztalgian criticising again and that things are different here in Australia, its much bigger, not so densely populated, less people, blah, blah blah. Yes they bl**dy well are different and thankfully so. We had Federal and State governments that acted early and decisively. That is the difference.

 

62% of all Covid 19 cases in Australia were "overseas acquired" I cannot find any UK source data but suggest that the UK would be similar and only now does the UK insist that International arrivals are quarantined via self isolation but only commencing on June 8?

 

As far as things go in my part of the world we have had 1 new case of Covid 19 since 24th April and that was on 7 May and no cases reported since.

Things are rapidly returning to a more normal state, I just hope they continue move cautiously. 

 

Keep safe and well

[catfan 14,793]

[Brew 5,422]

Most of your post seems to be supposition and conjecture so I'm not going over it point by point. Suffice it to say the main plank of your criticism is the speed and timing of the UK Govt in responding. 

Looking at and comparing the UK reaction with our near neighbours shows the Govt were not particularly dilatory in announcing a lockdown.

 

Choosing countries with a similar population size, NO nation went to lock down until after people had died from Covid.  Spain did not lock down until 10 days after the 3rd person died. Italy and France both waited for 14 days after the 3rd death to act and the UK waited a day longer at 15 days.

 

Spain had a 5 day lead, Italy and France 1 day but all 3 countries locked down before the UK yet after 25 days of lockdown the UK death toll was lower than Spain, Italy or France.

Clearly speed of response is important but the figures are not the be all and end all, there must be other, more important, factors in play to skew the figures to where they are now.

 

The Nightingale hospitals are not a sign of losing control but a remarkable achievement in trying to get ahead of the curve, which they did. 

 

 

 

I agree relaxing the lockdown may be a little too early but at the same time I'm surprised you think so. You have in the past made much of people having opinions that are not supported by the 'evidence' yet now criticise the Govt for acting on scientific advice. The Govt are not incompetent simply because you disagree with their decisions.

 

Re; Serco/G4S who else has the logistics and experience?

 

I'm at a loss about your criticism of the press conferences, "they are too polite!" seriously?  Would you prefer them to stand there and eff and jeff it?  Johnson packed his cabinet with the meek and the mild who he can be confident will stay on course, that much is true. I doubt there is much, if any, misinformation. these days facts are too easily checked.

I have not caught any in a lie, waffled when they are not certain of the answer but no outright lie. A lot of what we see on screen can be called padding, or it can be seen as giving the fullest explanation possible with all the available information.

In this age of trial by sound bite I'm fairly sure the majority of viewers will lose interest halfway down the second slide.

 

Where is Boris?  consider why the faceless are being paraded by rotation. Johnson, lover of the limelight, is not well. I don't believe he has fully recovered from his illness, when he does appear he does not seem to be at his ebullient best.

Excluding those of the press who's agenda is simply to generate acrimony and score points makes sense to me. I've seen it, you've seen it when some nobody wishing to make a name for themselves finds some obscure fact and hammers at when the speaker cannot give a definitive answer.

 

The Cummings farrago is just typical of his arrogance but it is overplayed by the press who hate him because of his low opinion and open dislike of journalists. The clown who drove almost 300 miles for a loaf of bread rated a mention but was forgotten the next day. Both broke the rules yet driving a car is nothing more than social distancing at speed, one was soon forgotten the other is manna to vindictive reporters.

 

[DJ360 6,730]

Just on Cummings for now.  It's ironic that he dislikes Journalists, yet he has chosen to advise Johnson, whose main profession has long been that of  journalist.  I'd say his dislike is reserved mostly for journos who question his ideas and motivations.  A very dangerous trait in combination with his very right wing views.

 

He is IMHO rightly reviled by many.  His opinions are very dubious indeed. He is widely accepted to have been responsible for the brief 'Herd Immunity' which effectively delayed the lockdown from what has turned out to be a very damaging period. He is also secretive and devious.  On a purely subjective basis I find him deeply creepy and weird, but I'd expect you to tell me that doesn't count.

 

Finally, Johnson had the brass neck to state yesterday that Cummings was just 'following the instincts of any father'.  What a bloody stupid thing to say.  the whole point of the lockdown regs was precisely to STOP people from following their natural instincts in order to control the spread of the virus.

 

I despair.

[Brew 5,422]

Far from countering your argument I agree with most of it however he did not originate the 'herd immunity' theory though he probably did raise it to Johnson as a possible course of action.. It seems to me (though I'm not qualified to judge), he is borderline Aspergers, he demonstrates little empathy or sympathy. What he says is in its purest sense logical, just not acceptable.

 

His recent trip to Durham was hypocritical but at the end of the day it hardly warrants the hysteria in the press or the silly demand by Labour MP Steve Reed for an inquiry, are they really so short of ammunition? The most I expect to happen is he forced to make a public apology then simply carry on.

[Stuart.C 491]

I know there are people (unable to quantify the number) who dislike Cummings for various reasons, some for the fact he's allegedly being backed by the Chinese, Russians or some other Group seeking World domination, but he was in a loose loose position.

I suspect the majority of the Country don't give a monkeys about what he has or hasn't done and that same majority will not suddenly be breaking any or all the lockdown rules.

I have no opinion one way or the other about him and it won't change my compliance with the lockdown.

I also have no allegiance to any political party, never have had and can't see why I ever would.

 

Yet again the press seem to think they know what the majority of the Country are thinking, yet again they are wrong.

One M.P calling for his dismissal / investigation has had, "hundreds of phone calls and messages in agreement", what about the other 60 odd million people in the Country who haven't expressed a view.

 

He chose to do what he did and he's accused of being in the wrong for travelling to where he could have care for his child if required.

If he , his wife and child had stayed in London and both he and his wife were hospitalised, their child would have been taken into care as there were no relatives nearby.

As Cummings would had been seen to have failed in the simple task of making suitable arangements for child care  he'd have then been declared by the Press as unsuitable to be an advisor to the P.M

 

And these are the same press who were shoulder to shoulder, not 2mtrs apart, when Cummings left his house and were reluctant to allow him 2mtrs clearance.

I call for all of those members of the Press to be prosecuted for failing to comply and there's plenty of video evidence.

And Ive just seen Sky news have sent a reporter and crew to Barnard Castle to investigate the allegations of cummings being seen there.

Is that justifiable?

[MargieH 7,604]

Prior to this, I wonder who looked after the child in London when he and his wife were both working....   I've read that the child is 'on the spectrum' but I feel that appropriate (live-in?) care could easily have been found more locally if they'd both become incapacitated.

[Jill Sparrow 10,307]

I will quite happily admit that I have broken the lockdown on many occasions to care for a dear friend who was dying and chose to do so in her own home.  I have sat with her, fetched medication for her, along with numerous other things I shouldn't have done and in doing so, I have put my friend and her 80 year old husband at risk. Why?  Because no one else from the health professions was doing anything to help and my natural instinct was to do what I could.

 

I don't look for praise or reward and you can criticise who may.  She would have done the same for me and I ain't about to apologise!

[philmayfield 6,144]

I fully support you Jill. There are occasions where rules have to be bent when you become an agent of necessity. Argue it with the authorities afterwards if you have to and let them prove you wrong.

 

[notty ash 371]

3 hours ago, Jill Sparrow said:

I will quite happily admit that I have broken the lockdown on many occasions to care for a dear friend who was dying and chose to do so in her own home.  I have sat with her, fetched medication for her, along with numerous other things I shouldn't have done and in doing so, I have put my friend and her 80 year old husband at risk. Why?  Because no one else from the health professions was doing anything to help and my natural instinct was to do what I could.

 

I don't look for praise or reward and you can criticise who may.  She would have done the same for me and I ain't about to apologise!

According to the regulations, 'to provide care or assistance to a vulnerable person' is a valid reason for leaving home. You were acting within the regulations and have absolutely nothing to feel guilty about. Well done!

[radfordred 6,284]

Another desperate attempt from remoaners, I hope if he goes Boris get Fararge in, he’s doing a fantastic job exposing the French boarder force, should have been our PM.  

 

 

[roger peatman 337]

2 hours ago, notty ash said:

According to the regulations, 'to provide care or assistance to a vulnerable person' is a valid reason for leaving home. 

Providing that person is not a member of the same household - if so, STAY AT HOME

[catfan 14,793]

Hypocritical journos who want Dominic Cummings blood. Don't lockdown rules apply to them re social distancing ?